Hey everyone, first post about my first home build.
My wife and I are wanting to purchase some land and build our first home. Of course like any couple starting out with their first home we want to do it on a budget. That number isn’t set in stone, so I’m hoping to find out what exactly I’m looking at cost wise. I’m pretty handy and would like to do as much of the project as I can. I also have some friends who are fairly experienced and some who do this type of work for a living.
- So we would like to buy a 1-2 acre lot to build on for starters, which runs somewhere in the neighborhood of 10-15k where we live.
- We are considering phased building, start with a garage, live in it and then build another part of the house the following season or even 2 seasons later.
- Trying to do this partially with cash that we will save over the next 2 years and possibly a small loan from the bank.
I’m curious if any of you have done your building this way, I realize there are pros and cons to do this. Is this a decent idea, a terrible idea or what? The home my parents bought when we first moved to the area was built in this manner and I have friends who did it. This was back in the 80’s and 90’s and I’m wondering if things have change making it not worth doing things this way anymore.
Thoughts?
Replies
How Long You Two Been Married?
How long do you expect to stay married?
Your post outlines a scenario familiar to many of the members of this forum I suspect. If you're young-ish, those of us who've lived that dream in our earlier lives might offer up a myriad of pitfalls that await.
In your case & without knowing anything more than what you've written, I suggest you speak with your county building authority to determine what kind of codes / zoning are enforced where you wish to buy property.
You need info on well & septic systems if you're not going to connect to city water & sewer.
You need info on whether you can build a 'garage' first then expect to live in it (NOT a long-term solution for married life) according to local codes.
If you're in a climate where it gets cold in winter you may be better off looking for a modest 'fixer-upper' suitably situated that'd permit building your dream home nearby. That way you'd have living space that's reasonably "user-friendly" and likely more appealing to a bank when you approach them for financing.
I'm sure your post will inspire other comments. I'm looking forward to reading them probably as much as you are!
Most difficult thing your marriage will ever face!!!!!
This will be the most difficult thing you will ever face in your marriage. You'd best be sure you're ready. This is the very first advice I give clients who want to build or do a major remodel in a home they occupy. It will put you at each other's throats for months on end. You will spend days not speaking to each other. If you're ready for that, then I might offer further advice, but address those issues first. All that said, it can still be a great adventure and fulfillment of dreams. Kind of like having children.
I have done building projects with 2 wives. The building was the only thing that kept me and the first one together and the second one likes it so much she became a professional home builder, building over 100 houses and bringing a new neighborhood out of the ground.
We are serial remodelers.
We occasionally have to schedule an argument about things but once we work it out, off we go.
The biggest problem with building a house is finding good subs, unless you are capable of doing a lot of it yourself. DIY certainly slows down the process. Something that a trade can bang out in a few days might take a homeowner months.
The other issue is access to building supplies at a reasonable price. You need to build a business realtionship with the suppliers.
I would guess that the hardest part is keeping the two wives apart.
DanH wrote:
I would guess that the hardest part is keeping the two wives apart.
1500 miles of interstate seems to do it ;)
Definitely check with the building/zoning folks. You could end up getting thrown out in the middle of winter if the zoning guys don't like you living in a garage, or the building inspectors don't feel the structure is suitable for occupancy.
And understand that banks are often reluctant to give loans for situations such as this.
a few thoughts come to mind....
1. I've been building for clients for 35 years. Everyone builds on a budget. Frist, second, third...whatever. You're no exception as a first time home builder.
2. I've built on a construction to perm loan with banks. They're not going to give you 2 years to complete the project. Most likely 6 months to a year max. If you plan on building on your own time table, then I suggest you build with your own money.
3. How are you hoping to find out "exactly" how much your first home is going to cost you if your going to build it yourself and have only basic experience? Crystal ball? YOu gonna write yourself a lump sum contract? Let me give you a reality check. You're not. If you want to get close, then you're going to have to come up with an exact set of architectural plans while outlining a reasonable budget based on an itemized cost spread sheet. Then your going to try like hell to meet it. You probably won't. If you're like most folks, you will exceed it by 30-50%. But at least you'll know how much your deviating from your idealized goal when it happens. Don't pull your hair out over it. Just go with the flow and adjust as best you can. If you're reasonable folks, then you all can expect a reasonable outcome.
BTW: $7-10k an acre is only a fantasy where I live, so good for you.
Have fun...and best of luck!
We've been with each other over 7 years, married for almost 3 years. I talked over the idea with her before even considering moving forward with it, having 2+ years of planning before we can even make a move. While I understand where you are coming from, women not always knowing what they are getting into (and us guys sometimes too).
We live in Fairbanks, Alaska. So yes, winters here get cold to say the least. I've lived here for 15 years, all of my adult life and am 27, my wife is 29. Not quite fresh out of the nest, but yes, young I'm sure in relation to others on here.
If we were to buy land in North Pole, there are no requirements to have the buildings approved by an engineer or architect, if it is in Fairbanks (15 miles difference) then it has to be reviewed. Both cities have codes obviously including requirements for an EGRESS, from my reading if its 1 large room a door counts as an EGRESS as long as it exits to the outside, i'll have to gather some more information on that though.
Up here, houses cost way to much and many of the "Fixer Uppers" are junkers and close to un-liveable without dropping enough cash into them to make them liveable whereas you could have purchased a proper house in the first place. Because of this, and the relatively inexpensive and size of property many people choose to build a small starter home while living in a large RV, camper or at an appartment.
One of the worst expenses in this area is heating cost, and that is something I'm trying to figure out for the short to long term. Start with a something like a Toyo stove for the small building and install a normal furnace later... Do geothermal exchange right off the bat and bare the expense up front? Can you run the lines for geothermal exchange for a single building and then add on to it afterwards without extreme costs...?
The story of building the garage first, then the rest is one of the most common things done up here, but i'm more curious about the down sides of building a house this way as opposed to say... building a small living quarters specifically to start instead. Its also common for people to throw up a small little cabin style home with a Toyo stove, then build a house over the years leaving the cabin as a rental or guest house (or to be picked up and sold).
Sorry, lots of information in many directions, I've got a lot of questions, equally as many statements and plenty of time to learn. I don't want to be told that I shouldn't build my first home, I want to be steered in the direction of learning what I need to know to start the process. Thanks in advance gentlemen.
MORE info is GOOD
Haemon wrote:I don't want to be told that I shouldn't build my first home, I want to be steered in the direction of learning what I need to know to start the process.
Here's hoping you didn't take my initial reply in a negative way; it wasn't meant to discourage you at all but merely a manner by which I could raise the biggest, most serious issue confronting you both (IF you value your relationship) while at the same time trying to tease out a little more info about your particular situation.
It appears now you're pretty well conversant with your local circumstances both as to weather as well as codes.
Money is the first in order of business: if you can afford to do what you've outlined without accessing a bank's financing it'll simplify things greatly. Banks right now are being ever more so persnickity with whom they choose to lend funds. Of course it may take you longer to accomplish what you set out to do, unless you're better off than 99% of the rest of us.
The heating thing probably is second as it'll be your single biggest expenditure going forward after your last nail has been driven. I'm no HVAC expert but I'd have to think laying down a geoexchange system designed for a larger, more extensive structure would be a practical approach even if it's not going to be fully utilized for a couple of years. Expensive, yes but perhaps a local contractor can add perspective on how their installations have changed in price over the past few years. Are they increasing? Then doing it up-front ought to save you something.
We haven't rouched on how having a kid can affect things either, whether planned for or not. Living in a 'construction office' & bringing up a newborn ought to be considered too.
While building.
I found it easy to live in our caravan, it has everything that you need, and is very comfortable and warm during the winter.
Everything takes longer than you hoped.
Check out every book from the public library that is related to home building. Purchase the ones that you deem worthy or relavant to you.
Talk to some of the many people who are buiding in this manner.
If you don't have actual building or carpentry experience, then get some. Volunteer for Habitat or for a friend who's building a shed. You have to know what its like to swing a hammer.
The apartment over the garage thing only makes sense if you ultimately want an apartment over the garage. If you don't then build the garage (without the overhead door yet) and live in that. If you don't want a garage then build a dog house. Whatever you build you should want because it all takes time and money.
Like many others, I've gone through several remodels and new construction builds. For me that remodels are the worst. Having to disrupt ones home for extended periods is the pits. New construction is taking place outside the home and is easier. My wife and I lived in my commercial building for 11 months while we gutted and remodeled our home in Anchorage. Cooking was on two electric hot plates and a microwave. We endured and we were middle aged then. It helped that the building was beautiful and warm. But it wasn't a house. A few years later we did it again. (call us stupid?) This time we rented a cottage with a real kitchen. It was still hard, but doable. You are younger, it will be easier.
Are you sure you want to live in Fairbanks? Your answer is probably going to be yes. That means you are a bit crazy. Just the way one needs to be to pull off a build like you propose.
Go to the library. Start reading. And visit the site: http://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com/ Learn what you should do to build a comfortable home in your climate.
Go for it, DIY everything you think you can and then do some more and learn. Building is simple, not rocket science.
I was 25 and wife 27 with 2 kids when we built the house we are still living in. Startied bulding in 1971.
DIY 100%, every shovel of dirt, every nail, every yard of concrete. 5300 sq ft house (including basement)
We had stashed away all the plumbing fixtures, many electrical fixtures, etc. during the previous 5 years when we found good deals.
Best years of our life (contrary to others experience), although the 4 and 6 YO kids did not like being in a corner with a heater and a few toys while we were closing it in.
Best financial investment ever, paid cash as we built, 2-1/2 years from starting to clear the 500 foot road in to moving in, and another 2 years to 100% finish all the interior. Did have a small mortgage on the land, all building was cash.
In 1971 #2 and btr DF was only $110 MBF here (Seattle area) and concrete only $15/yard, was able to build (including all appliances and carpet, etc) the house for under $15 K then.
We built it so that 1/4 of the house (bath, kitchen, 1-1/2 BR) was closed off from the rest at the begining and only heated that 1/4 for the first year.
Lived 3 miles away for the first 2-1/2 years, wife was home with kids, me a full time job. Up to 20 hours on house on weekends and usually 10-15 during the week.
In 2013, built an alternate dwelling unit in son's back yard, had saved scrounged wood for the previous 20 years. Built the 800 sq ft house for under $10K, and $1.8K of that was for PERMITS!!! (yetch) .
Caveats ( did have engineering degree, so started having some knowledge, and wife and I both have same frugal nature)
Photos are of the $10K house. $12 sq foot. I think you can see it is not a sleazy shed. Some of pics are still under construction.
Examples of frugality, although you may not have quite the selection of free 'craigslist' item in Fairbanks as in Seattle. - e.g ALL the bathroom cabinects and sink were free, the toilet was new for $0 at a garage sale, all the mini-kitchen cabinets were free CL items (which is why the upper and lower are different style <G>), all of the bookcases were from free pallets that (did nave to buy new formica counter top material). The fancy front arch window as a Lowes retun, marked down form $1600 to $190 (had watched it at the store for a few weeks, when I saw the guy marking it down from $450 to $190, snapped it up)
PS:
IF your are tempted to build a log house - DONT, or at least re-consider.
Log homes are for rich folks who pay others to do the hard labor and who have very specialized tools.
At least that is my experience.
Wife and I also built a cabin on property we have near St. Helens.
We started out building a llog cabin, as we had 'free' trees.
Found out after just the first 2 courses (only a 400 sq ft cabin) that building with logs ia a LOT more work that stick framing. If you get a bandsaw mill and saw your own logs, it is still less work than building a log house. And, you would be amazed at how much logs can shrink if you do not have the luxury of having your logs under cover for 3-4 years to dry.
we Used the logs already in place as a post and beam 'foundation', and built stick frame on top of that.
PS2: acting as your own general contractor vs. 100% DIY.
Again this is only person experience, but in having been on church building commities, found it was often easier to just plain do the whole job myself with a couple of memeber helpers than FIND a competent subcontractor. Folks in the business have their trusted network to rely on, finding someone competent for a one-job task may be a daunting and frustrating task. Easier (and less time consuming) for me to just do the task myself.
PS3: All of the above is, best of all, the best excuse there is for buying tools<G>
I built a house back when I was young and idealistic. I ended up doing a thread about it here, called "The Spec House from Hell".
Unfortunately about 2/3 of the thread got lost in a software update. So there's no point linking to the thread.
What someone else said about the stress on your marriage is dead on. We were about half way through building that one when my Wife asked me to move out.
If you go through with it, plan on things taking 2 - 3 times as long as you think it will. People who tell you they'll help get busy and don't show. One of my kids got pneumonia in the middle of the build and was hospitalized for a week. We had the worst winter in 20 years when I was trying to get it under roof. Things you order don't show up or are wrong when they get there. Setbacks are the norm.
I don't know many DIY builders who finished their own house on budget. Make sure you're in good shape before you start.
True dat.
"What someone else said about the stress on your marriage is dead on."
Amen. I watched several client's marriages fall apart as they tried to live in their house while it was being remodeled, which is a lot less stressful than what the OP is proposing. Please consider the huge stress on your familty carefully before you embark on this journey.
Good luck.
Doable but:
My siblings and I grew up in that house. I do not recommend it for most people.
My Dad was the engineer son of a family who were builders and millrights, who had worked every summer since his twelfth birthday as a helper in various trades, so that he would be able to make an informed decision when he chose his future trade.
WWII interfered, and he went to college afterwards on GI bill and became an engineer instead of going into the trades. He was probably more skilled, and experienced than you are. And, it was a pretty tough 15-years of him building the house.
The guys who have their marriage survive a project like this generally have a background in the trades, and buddies who can help on the ones they do not know well.
That said: If you decide to do this you need to plan for phased construction. If I were to do one it would start with a detached 3-car garage/shop that would include an "office" aka bedroom, a bathroom and laundry hook up. This is quick and easy to build, and gives you a weather proof space to set up tools to make the cabinets and assemblies needed for the house, and a chance to learn about building a structure where the mistakes are less critical than the finished house. Nothing fancy, T1-11 siding and a metal roof.
The main house should also be simple. Look for information on SIPs. They seem like a straight forward approach for a novice builder, particularly if you work with a good manufacturer. I've done two of them now and the book from Fine Homebuilding was a great aid and I highly recommend it. The details it includes are pretty good, but be sure to work with the manufacturers designers if you choose to use SIPs.