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SIDING SCREWUP--IDEAS??

Dinosaur's picture

Lovely house (okay, the rafter tails and rakes and fascias are all painstakingly scroll-cut and edge-beaded and corner-matched. That part's lovely. OTOH the archie could have taken some lessons from Sarah Susanka on window distribution. But that's another story...). The place has maybe 5000+ SF of 5"-exposure rough pine clapboard siding, all of which was supposed to have been pre-stained with the Sikkens Cetol 1/23 system before it was nailed up.


But the yard which supplied the pre-stained siding forgot to put on the Cetol 23 (the topcoat) and duh! the young guy who built the place didn't notice. (To give him some slack, I should say that this isn't an impossible mistake to make. Cetol 1 by itself looks real nice and has a bit of a shine when it's brand-spanking fresh. If you're in a hurry and haven't worked with Sikkens before, well....)


The other mistake he made was to clear-cut the lot so there are no trees whatsoever on it. And no deep eaves or porch roofs, either. (Okay: It's a 3-storey-tall, nekkid box, and the nicest thing about it is that lovingly hand-tooled woodwork 'way up top.) Result: That house is sunlit from dawn to dusk and you guessed it, the unprotected stain-colour coat got UV blasted and within 2 years, it had faded to almost white.


The original owner/builder then sold it, and the second owner promptly slapped something--we don't know quite what--on the siding. Some sort of who-noze-whut clear topcoat. Whatever it was, it couldn't take the sun either, and has cracked, peeled, and crinkled real bad. It's plumb butt ugly right now. No other way to say it.


Enter owner number three, whom I met today while walking the 'hood with Owl and stuffing my business flyers into screen doors. He wants it re-stained.


Lovely. I hate painting but I don't mind staining. And not only will it keep me off the street and outta trouble, it will make that house look as good as it's gonna until somebody re-fenestrates it. And the woodwork up top--which was properly two-coated with Sikkens and is in perfect shape--deserves a better background than this radiation-blasted siding.


The problem is, there is still enough of the ??? topcoat stuff sticking to the siding to make penetration of a fresh coat of Cetol 1 impossible.


It's gotta be scraped. All 5000+ SF. And the clapboards are rough-sawn white pine, so scraping it while maintaining the rough-sawn texture is gonna be a cast-iron [CUTE LITTLE PUPPY]. I don't even know if it's possible. Never tried to do that before, and certainly not on this scale.


 


Ideas?? Suggestions?? I'm almost tempted to suggest he just bite the big bullet and replace the siding completely. It might cost less.



Dinosaur


How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not brought
low by this? For thine evil pales before that which
foolish men call Justice....


Dinosaur

How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not brought
low by this? For thine evil pales before that which
foolish men call Justice....

(post #106313, reply #1 of 41)

Any possibility of using a wire wheel on it?

(post #106313, reply #2 of 41)

If I could find or fabricate a 5"-wide wire rotary brush that might work. It would remove the rough-sawn texture but impart a new, uniform texture if handled carefully.


Dinosaur


How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not brought
low by this? For thine evil pales before that which
foolish men call Justice....


Dinosaur

How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not brought
low by this? For thine evil pales before that which
foolish men call Justice....

(post #106313, reply #8 of 41)

There's always sandblasting too. I don't think it would cause a problem on roughsawn siding.

I know you can get 2" thick wheels, with various diameter center holes. Several wheels could be stacked on an arbor of some sort.

Maybe a sidewinder saw with an extended arbor and 5 inches of wire brushes mounted on it, with a guard of course covering the wheels to be safe(r).

(post #106313, reply #3 of 41)

What about this? Seems to work well and doesn't tear up the surface too much.


http://www.wagnerspraytech.com/portal/painteater_spray,93265,747.html


 


"It is what it is."

 

"It is what it is."

(post #106313, reply #4 of 41)

Thanks, but anything that rotates flat against the surface of the siding will leave circular tool marks. I need to preserve--as much as possible--the band-sawn texture of the siding.


Dinosaur


How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not brought
low by this? For thine evil pales before that which
foolish men call Justice....


Dinosaur

How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not brought
low by this? For thine evil pales before that which
foolish men call Justice....

(post #106313, reply #6 of 41)

thinkin...thinkin...thinkin.....


Powerwash?


Maybe a coat of ?? to soften the stuff, then blast it with a powerwasher.


Just a though, I'm still thinkin...


--------------------------------------------------------


Cheap Tools at MyToolbox.net
See some of my work at AWorkOfWood.com

~ Ted W ~

(post #106313, reply #5 of 41)

walnut shell or corn cob blaster it...

 


Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming


WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!

"Some days it's just not worth chewing through the restraints"

(post #106313, reply #9 of 41)

Okay, you and/or Fast Eddie explain to me about walnut shells. I don't know that one.


Is this a dry process? Available as standard rental gear from say, United Rentals? Is the blasting unit scaffold-friendly in size?



Dinosaur


How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not brought
low by this? For thine evil pales before that which
foolish men call Justice....


Dinosaur

How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not brought
low by this? For thine evil pales before that which
foolish men call Justice....

(post #106313, reply #10 of 41)

crushed waltnut shells or some similar aggregate used as you would a sand blaster....


but....


the shells or corn cob aggregate is more of a low power balsting unit that is friendlier to what is being shot... does well at removeing paint while leaving the substrate intact... 


if the blasting angle is oblique enough and you you move slow enough you can give smooth cedar a rough texture or you make simulated band saw cuts....


rent any place and take with you on the staging....


 


 


Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming


WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!

"Some days it's just not worth chewing through the restraints"

(post #106313, reply #11 of 41)

"rent any place and take with you on the staging...."


Walnut shell or corn husk blasting is one way to go, however...


You wouldn't actually take the unit up on the staging, only the hose and nozzle. Isn't the compressor a big tow-behind type?



--------------------------------------------------------


Cheap Tools at MyToolbox.net
See some of my work at AWorkOfWood.com


Edited 5/26/2008 12:23 am by Ted W.

~ Ted W ~

(post #106313, reply #13 of 41)

the hopper on the small units can go up on the staging...


remember there are different size units...


 


Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming


WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!

"Some days it's just not worth chewing through the restraints"

(post #106313, reply #12 of 41)

These things come with multiple hoses/nozzles? I'm figuring, I need a helper anyway for shifting the staging. Can't have him picking his nose while I'm hosing down the place with nuts.


This is a dry process, right? I don't wanna pressure wash it.



Dinosaur


How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not brought
low by this? For thine evil pales before that which
foolish men call Justice....


Dinosaur

How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not brought
low by this? For thine evil pales before that which
foolish men call Justice....

(post #106313, reply #14 of 41)

the really big honkers do multiple hoses... those stay on the ground....


and it is a bone dry deal....


and it will be nut shell fragments..


differnt types of medium dictate their hardness or softness or how abrasive they are...


hang a catch tarp and you can send the medium back thru... that will really give yur helper something to do...


 


 


Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming


WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!

"Some days it's just not worth chewing through the restraints"

(post #106313, reply #18 of 41)

http://www.kramerindustriesonline.com/blasting-media.htm


http://www.kramerindustriesonline.com/blasting-systems.htm


http://www.nortonsandblasting.com/


 


Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming


WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!

"Some days it's just not worth chewing through the restraints"

(post #106313, reply #22 of 41)

Dino


Along with the walnut blasting there is also soda.


There is  a guy here in my little burg that is taking an old grainery and converting it to a house. He rented your standard sand blaster and bought the soda, I think in 50# boxes, don't recall how much of it he used but it was quite a bit.  Cleaned up all of his post and beams, 1 X's  inside of this grainery and they look like the day they were erected. Not smooth either, sort of a rough sawn look.


When he was done he vac'd up all the soda.


Just another option.


Doug

(post #106313, reply #23 of 41)

Wait'll you see what an ice blaster can do. They can blast mold off of BOOKS and archival paper.

Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks


Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations


New book alert; Eckhart Tolle "A new earth"


A must read.

www.richmondrenovationsandrestoration.com  

(post #106313, reply #24 of 41)

We use these at work. Dry ice with plasma. http://purco2.com/manualapplications.html

(post #106313, reply #25 of 41)

But wait until you have to pay the carbon tax on that.

.
.
A-holes. Hey every group has to have one. And I have been elected to be the one. I should make that my tagline.
. William the Geezer, the sequel to Billy the Kid - Shoe

(post #106313, reply #26 of 41)

Carbon will help prevent the global cooling that is on the way.

(post #106313, reply #27 of 41)

Dino:

Might want to use the corncob media -- istr walnut sawdust is really bad for landscaping. Dunno if the hulls have the same properties.

Leon
Leon

(post #106313, reply #28 of 41)

I am certain the shells for blast media are English Walnuts, they don't contain the toxic Juglan that Black walnuts do.

Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks


Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations


New book alert; Eckhart Tolle "A new earth"


A must read.

www.richmondrenovationsandrestoration.com  

(post #106313, reply #31 of 41)

Listen, I don't even know if I won't have to buy the walnuts in the supermarket and shell them myself yet. (Man that would leave me with enough nutmeats to make 30,000 pounds of grandma's crescent pastry filling....)


Leon, Sphere, Eddy, and all--thanks for the ideas. Gotta start making some phone calls. Keep 'em coming. There's always a solution....


 



Dinosaur


How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not brought
low by this? For thine evil pales before that which
foolish men call Justice....


Dinosaur

How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not brought
low by this? For thine evil pales before that which
foolish men call Justice....

(post #106313, reply #32 of 41)

I must admit I thought that both had about the same chemical makeup, with black walnut having a higher concentration.

It was black walnut sawdust that hosed Bob Vaughan's garden.

Leon
Leon

(post #106313, reply #33 of 41)

I still like the corn cob or even cracked corn idea..I have a log home and some of the logs need a good blasting, hence my search and discovery of CO2 in that process.


Also involved ina  major restoration and we toyed with soda blasting, but the volumne was excessive and the soda is not best for multilayers of paint on wood, but great for metal.


Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks


Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations


New book alert; Eckhart Tolle "A new earth"


A must read.

www.richmondrenovationsandrestoration.com  

(post #106313, reply #21 of 41)

One of the advantages of walnut shell blasting is that it is ecologically friendly. 

"Put your creed in your deed."   Emerson


"When asked if you can do something, tell'em "Why certainly I can", then get busy and find a way to do it."  T. Roosevelt

"Put your creed in your deed."   Emerson

"When asked if you can do something, tell'em "Why certainly I can", then get busy and find a way to do it."  T. Roosevelt

(post #106313, reply #7 of 41)

Blast it with walnut shells?

"Put your creed in your deed."   Emerson


"When asked if you can do something, tell'em "Why certainly I can", then get busy and find a way to do it."  T. Roosevelt

"Put your creed in your deed."   Emerson

"When asked if you can do something, tell'em "Why certainly I can", then get busy and find a way to do it."  T. Roosevelt

(post #106313, reply #15 of 41)

I've been through this with cabins that have had multiple coats of Cetol 1, then been left until parts had peeled and others grown black mold under the finish. I've had paint store reps, and manufacturer's reps out. They all just shook their heads, and suggested I sand or scrape it off.  My experience has been that even after sanding there is enough residual that the wood doesn't take a fresh coat of even the same finish smoothly.


Sorry, no good answers, just sympathy. Sikkens is a good system if it is maintained regularly, but let it get away from you and any remediation is difficult. The cabins are mainly Forest Green now.

(post #106313, reply #16 of 41)

Forest green would actually work moderately well on this place. But most people who buy a wood-finish house want to keep it that way. I doubt he'd go for a paint-over.



Dinosaur


How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not brought
low by this? For thine evil pales before that which
foolish men call Justice....


Dinosaur

How now, Mighty Sauron, that thou art not brought
low by this? For thine evil pales before that which
foolish men call Justice....

(post #106313, reply #17 of 41)

ummmmmmmmmmmm.....


Forest Green is a "natural" color....


self renewing...


 


Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming


WOW!!! What a Ride!
Forget the primal scream, just ROAR!!!

"Some days it's just not worth chewing through the restraints"

(post #106313, reply #19 of 41)

Offer the alternatives.

T&M to hand scrape, stain and seal. Probably $50,000

Fixed bid to paint. $15,000

Fixed bid to R & R and stain. $25,000

Let him decide what he wants to do...it's his house and his pocketbook.

Bob's next test date: 12/10/07