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Tile walls out of plumb

Sbds's picture

Hope you can help.
I am doing a bathroom,and am currently tiling the tub surround. Apparently, the idiot "me" did not install the backer board plum.
The back and sidewall tile meet at the bottom of the tub, but by the time they reach the ceiling, their is a 1/2 inch gap between the back wall and the sidewall. This gap is too large to fill with caulk. Can I use a tile called Bead Tile (it reminds me of 1/4 round molding)? If I use this tile, can I use the same thinset I used to adhere the tile to the backer board? Will it adhere tile to tile? Also, if I use this tile, do I grout it or caulk it? Because I have read on this forum, not to grout corners.
Thank you in advance for your help
Danny

I posted this question on John Bridge and got two different answers. One said to use adhesive caulk, the other said to rough up the tile and use versabond to attach the Bead Tile. What is the opinion of the folks on Breaktime.

(post #103296, reply #1 of 20)

Usually one would overcome this problem by varying the grout widths slightly and making scribed cuts in the corners.  Of course this method would depend on the size and type of tile you're using.


As for the corner tile fix, use adhesive caulk.

(post #103296, reply #2 of 20)

How far along are you into this job?


Which wall is out of plumb?


Change your tile layout so that when you get to the corner and work your way up you have to cut the corner tile to fit the out of plumb situation. With a wet saw you can make cuts that are exact and follow the ever so slight angle change and you'll never know the walls aren't right when you get done.


If you try to use a vertical filler or applique it may/will end up looking like a hack job.

(post #103296, reply #3 of 20)

I have all three walls done. I did the back wall first, then moved to the side walls. I put a plumb line in the center of each side wall and tied in both directions. By the time I saw the problem it was to late to go back and fix. I realize the corner bead will be a cheat but it is the only option I can think of.
Danny

(post #103296, reply #4 of 20)

but it is the only option I can think of.


Wrong answer.  How long do you expect this tile job to last?  How often will you look at it and get pissed cuz it's not right?  Best thing to do is take out the end walls and do it again. 


Ralph had the right idea: make sure you have cut tile in the corner, and adjust to fit.  Or, drop a plumb line in the corner such that the top tile is full size, and then cut the lower tiles to the line.


 


"Put your creed in your deed."   Emerson


"When asked if you can do something, tell'em "Why certainly I can", then get busy and find a way to do it."  T. Roosevelt

"Put your creed in your deed."   Emerson

"When asked if you can do something, tell'em "Why certainly I can", then get busy and find a way to do it."  T. Roosevelt

(post #103296, reply #5 of 20)

"their is a 1/2 inch gap between the back wall and the sidewall. This gap is too large to fill with caulk"


Since when is a 1/2 inch gap too large to fill?


That's still very easy to caulk. Get a tube of Phenoseal, cut the spout to allow for a fat bead, then caulk it, but don't try to fill the gap. Fill it about halfway. Let that dry overnight. The next day, re-caulk it and NOW you will be able to fill the gap. I see nothing wrong with doing like that. Are the wall tiles white? If so, this would blend in and nobody (who wasn't really looking hard) would ever tell.


I would think using those half round listellos would look a little weird up there plus getting them to stick might present a slight hassle.


Mike

(post #103296, reply #6 of 20)

Why can't you just use some fiberglass tape and fill the gap before you tile...maybe I'm not understanding you...sorry


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(post #103296, reply #7 of 20)

I'm in the same boat as Andy-


Are you saying there's a gap between your side and back backerboards?  I'm assuming this is hardi or durock or something.  You should tape with fiberglass tape and mortar to fill that gap.


Then, layout the tiles so you can cut that last peice out of most of a tile if possible- it's better than having a little sliver of tile stuck there, and it doesn't look as obvious.


zak


"When we build, let us think that we build forever.  Let it not be for present delight nor for present use alone." --John Ruskin


"so it goes"


 

zak

"When we build, let us think that we build forever.  Let it not be for present delight nor for present use alone." --John Ruskin

"so it goes"

 

(post #103296, reply #8 of 20)

The gap is between the tile, not the Durock. I have all the tile installed on both side walls so tapering the last row of tile is not a option. I now realize that cutting the last row of tiles to fit would have been the correct way to do it, but I am now just looking for a solution after the fact.

(post #103296, reply #9 of 20)

What did you use to adhere the tile to the wall.


What size tile did you use?


It's only been one day, right?


Get out the flat blade and lift those tiles off the wall and start over.


Or, lift off the corner stack and maybe you can find a similar tile in color and texture but larger that you could cut down and fit to the space.


Or, change to a different color and call it a design element where you could form a picture frame of the different tile on each end wall. You would have to remove additional tile for that effort.


 

(post #103296, reply #10 of 20)

The tile is 4 & 1/4 X 4 & 1/4 white shiny ceramic. The adhesive is Tec ceramic tile adhesive.
I like your idea of removing the last row and using a bigger different tile as a design element.
This is why I love Breaktime, all the great opinions I receive.
Thanks again,
Danny

Ps. One wall I installed yesterday, the other wall I installed two days ago. How do I remove the tile that has been on for a few days.

(post #103296, reply #11 of 20)

Are either of the pairs of walls plumb?  If so, you might pull off both last runs.  Tile the bogus wall first, getting the cut to fill the slant close enough the Plumb walls tile can cover.  Easier to cut a sq. cut to fit.


Best of luck.


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http://www.quittintime.com/


 

A Great Place for Information, Comraderie, and a Sucker Punch.

Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.


http://www.quittintime.com/

 


(post #103296, reply #12 of 20)

Hmmm.....TEC Adhesives.......
"For...indoor applications that are not ordinarily exposed to water"

http://www.tecspecialty.com/product_sub_cat.asp?catId=65

"How do I remove the tile that has been on for a few days."

Since you used a mastic for the tub surround you can remove it ANYTIME with a splash of water and your knife.......

Is there a showerhead within this same surround ?

(post #103296, reply #13 of 20)

Yes there is a shower head in the surround. I don't know much about tile so I did not go to Home Depot I went to a very large tile store. When I was talking to the tile guy he said he has been working in the family run business for 20 years. So much for an expert. I hope the tile stays on the wall.

Thanks for your input.

Danny

(post #103296, reply #14 of 20)

Sorry for your problems.  Your best choice of action at this point is to strip off all the tile.  After cleaning off the backer board (assuming you used either a Hardibacker of cement board tile backer) you should apply a moisture membrane.  Red Guard is the variety I use, from Home Depot, and it is applied easily enough using a trowel, roller, brush, etc.  Three coats are usually called for.  After the membrane is applied, set you tile using a fortified thinset.  And layout your grout lines prior to setting, this will show you where your trouble spots might be.


But before you do that, buy (or see if the library has) Micheal Burn's book, Setting Tile.'  It's sort of a tile Bible.


Good luck.


 


"I am the master of my fate, I am the captain of my soul."  Invictus, by Henley.

"I am the master of my fate, I am the captain of my soul."  Invictus, by Henley.

(post #103296, reply #15 of 20)

If he's gonna take all the tiles off..ugh..and its the wall thats out of plumb he may as well throw on another sheet of 1/4-1/2" cbu to bring the wall in to close up the gap and also not have to worry about getting every drop of glue off. assuming its the right wall.


 


 


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And that sign said - no tress passin'
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Now that side was made for you and me!" Woody Guthrie 1956


 


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(post #103296, reply #16 of 20)

At that rate, before he's done the tile will be hung over the tub, not the flange.  But you're right, it would probably be faster/more efficient to layer another sheet.  I'd worry about it not being totally flat, however, not knowing the condition of the mastic residue. 


 


"I am the master of my fate, I am the captain of my soul."  Invictus, by Henley.

"I am the master of my fate, I am the captain of my soul."  Invictus, by Henley.

(post #103296, reply #17 of 20)

The back wall is out of plumb and has a window on it. Furring it out with backerboard will be such an an issue with the window. The side walls and back wall meet at the tub, but at the ceiling they are out 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch. I will probily remove the last row near the corner and try to use bigger tiles to cut on a taper to fill the gap. A gap of that size I feel will be too wide to cover by cheating the vertical lines. The current tile I used is 4 1/4 X 4 1/4. The side walls run wild in to the room and terminate with bull nose a few inches past the tub. The big question is about the adhesive. I used Tec, that the tile store recommended. Do I have to remove the tile. The web site for Tec, states it is good for hotels. I would translate that to one shower a day.
Let me know what you think.
Danny

(post #103296, reply #18 of 20)

I hesitate to bring this point up, but I think (guess) your walls are out of plumb because you capped the metal upturn flange of the tub with the cement board. If this is the case, you could remove the first course of tile and cut the board above the flange, punch the board in and screw it. If this is not the case, then forget I brought it up. I like the "cut the larger to fit option".

If you didn't have time to do it right the first time, how come you've got time to do it over again?

(post #103296, reply #19 of 20)

Well first the folks at JB are very knowlegdeable on tile issues.

But if I understand your problem you have a 1/2 gap at the top where the surround meets the ceiling.

You have already begun tiling and would have to tearout the installation to correct the out of plumb condition
Since your a HO and are just trying to correct a cosmetic issue, why couldnt you use a large decorative cornor mold tile to fill the gap at the top. If you were a pro would tell you to tear it out and reinstall.

for a more accurate answer please post a picture of the condition

 


             


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(post #103296, reply #20 of 20)

To fix the gap I removed the last row and got bigger tile of the same kind, and I cut it to fit.
Thanks for your help.