Hey Guys & Gals:
‘been a long time. See the forum got a facelift.
Questions re composite decking choices and what to watch out for:
1/2 million $ house, new construction on relatively tight budget (what else is new). Homeowner wants low maintenance deckinig on a non-covered deck. The chioices for 5/4 deckinig boards are:
- Choice Deck $18.67 for 12’er
- Fiberon $16.68 for 12′
- Premium P.T. $09.96 for 12′
Which of these 2 fiber composite decking have you used – good or bad results? Fastening – I guess it’s gotta be predrilled/countersunk and use screws? Saw in another thread where they talked about using ss trim head screws… guess ya don’t have to predrill then? What’s good for gaping – end gap? – side gap? Cuts and machines similar to wood? What about discoloration of the surface over time & cleaning?
What else do I need to look out for?
Yea, I know, I’m behind the times… anyway, any input is greatly appreciated.
Thanks Much,
Matt G.
Replies
I just finished using three 12' boards of the Fiberon stuff in cedar color.
Test screwed in a tan coated screw and it raised a unsightly mushroom that didn't pound down too well.
Ended up shaving it off with a sharp chisel but it still shows a white ring around the screw head.
There is a special screw for composite lumber but they (Home Dump) didn't have them. Lowes had only the gray.
(There is an ad for these special screws in the latest FH.)
I opted for ring shank stainless steel siding nails (8d, 2-1/2").
Pre-drilled all the holes through the composite boards only and pounded them in.
When I tried to hammer them in without pre-drilling, they kept bending on me.
The Fiberon comes with wood grain on one side and none on the other.
(I used the grain side up.)
They scratch very easily but I didn't want to use PT.
Thanks for the reply. Home Dump (hand't heard that one) only has them in lt. gray here in Carolina. When you had the trouble with the puckering, was that even after predrilling/precountersinking? Also, I guess that with as much plastic that is in the Fibron staining isn't really an option?
Thanks,Matt G.
Edited 3/29/2002 4:49:23 PM ET by DIRISHINME
If you really want a top notch job, use a concealed fastener system. This will cost you another $2 per sf but it will look great. You can use a high grade galvanized spiral nail (Maze). There is no need to predrill and no mushroom problem. You do see the nails but this is straightforward and inexpensive. We have used trim screws which do not create a very discernable mushroom. We did not use stainless as they were not readily available at the time. I would look into this in the future. I was not impressed with the screws recommended by the supplier which did create a large mushroomed hole. Neither were the customers. Live and learn.
I'm sold on Fastap/poly2 screws with duracoat. The cost $350 per box of 2500 but they save you having to pre-drill. The screws are self-drilling & self countersinking and I break bits putting them in but have never stripped a screw head. The screw leaves no mushroom and sinks flush with the decking. Go to http://www.fastapscrews.com
As for decking- that would be a customer preferrance thing, but I would lean toward Trex or Choice decking for the money.Bob
"Rather be a hammer than a nail"
ProDeck - thanks for the info and the link. Got any additional thoughts about Choice Deck? End/side gap size? Surface durability? Machineability? Things to watch out for?
Anyone have something to add on this or other composite decking products?
Thanks,
Matt G.
Edited 3/31/2002 2:30:22 PM ET by DIRISHINME
Edited 3/31/2002 3:09:28 PM ET by DIRISHINME
Usually each manufacturer publishes an installation manual for their product which explains how to fasten and how much expansion and contraction to expect with each product, and how much Gap is required to eliminate buckling.
Most of the composite decking is easy to cut rout and sand.
I personally do not like the Plastic decking Bob
"Rather be a hammer than a nail"
Matt, my choice would be Trex, never pre-drilled AND the mushroom created has always settled back in after a day or two, which leaves a nice clean almost fastener-free look. It's available in 3 or 4 colors and the brown original color weathers to a Cape Cod grey after about 8 m0s. to a year depending on the weather.
As to gapping, in warm weather (hot summer) a small 1/16 gap or less, In cooler weather a larger gap, maybe 3/16" to 1/4 ". This allows for appropriate exspansion and contraction. For the gap between boards I go with a min. 1/4" , I actually have cut 1/4" ply into strips 6" long x 2" wide. I set them across the tops of the joists (6" running horizontally) and I do three or four rows at a time. I use the deck tool to lock in the rows against the shims , then fasten the last row, remove the deck tool and move 2 or 3 joists down, set the deck tool , fasten the last deck board and on and on. I say a 1/4" min. to allow for debris to be washed off the deck rather than being caught between the deck boards.
Trex also meets ADA reqs. for anti-slip surfaces and seems not to get to hot for tender young feet in the heat of the summer.
Geoff
I've used Boardwalk from certainteed. Good grip-shun, easy to drill, cut and rout. Stable, no big expansion/contraction swings. Heavy, floppy and slippery sliding around a cutting table. Don't exceed manufacturers span limit, but it's just like wood when holding to 16" centers for the 5/4 product. I used stainless screws and countersunk them. Looks good but a chore. I didn't like the preliminary test with pounding down the mushroom so I countersunk and used a screw gun to keep em flush with the face of the board. I would like to try a new fastener I just saw in FHB. A trim head type supposedly no predrilling necessary. I liked the lt gray color and found it to be cooler in the sun than the darker brown trex I had used. Seemed a little more traction surface than trex also. This winter it performed well in the ice/snow/salt and shoveling.
__________________________________________
Remodeling Contractor just outside the Glass City.
Thanks for the info guys. The materials will be ordered within a few days, and work starts in a week.
Matt G.
We ended up using Trex. It is a dark redrish-brown color which I think is called Midera (sp). The customer wanted a brown color, not a grey. Not sure what color the stuff will be once it weathers. The deck floor boards alone for the 14.5'x17' deck were around $1,000. Everything worked out Ok, however the SS trim head screws still mushroomed the synthetic boards so I used some other kind of colored deck screws called Phillips II from Lowes that were sepcifically for composite lumber. Didn't have to predrill except for on the ends of the boards, otherwise they would kinda buldge out and crack a bit. I spaced the "boards" (end & side) with an 8 penny nail which yeilded about a 1/8" gap. The deck surface has a very uniform look to it.
All in all, trex is not bad at all to work with, but the screwing down was a bit of a PITA (I mean knees).
I'm building a fairly standard type balustrade with 2x4 top and bottom rails (edges beveled with a router), 2x2 balusters and 6x6 newel posts that I fancied up a bit with a router and cut some finals in the top with a skill saw. I think it's gonna look pretty good once I'm done.
Thanks for the sugestions,MattMatt
V Star 1100 Classic
Black-n-Chrome
My experience is that you didn't space the boards far enough side to side. I have seen decks like this (especially when installed in cooler weather) with a very small gap which catches all manner of things. Hopefully it will work out for you.
Jon Blakemore
The day I installed it it was 80 degrees F. The hotest it gets around here is about 95. I think it will be fine. Thanks for the info though. One of the reasons I spaced it at 1/8" is that way the boards came out even - didn't have to rip the last board.
For what it's worth I used Fiberon material on a deck that's now 18 months old. I had the same mushrooming problems and ended up predrilling the holes to get rid of that problem.
But more seriously the material has started cracking badly. I now need to replace 12 boards, and guess what - Home Depot doesn't carry the material anymore.
At the time it was the only composite decking I could find in the area. Now I have $1500 worth of material with a 25 year warranty and nobody to support it.
I love the composites, and I'll be replacing this with Trex this summer.