Concerned about quality with my builder, take a look, be the judge.
My wife and I are having a home built here in coastal NC. It’s a huge investment and step for us that we’ve been working extremely hard towards. We couldn’t come near the budget of having a completely custom home built, so had to go with a developer that did allow us to modify the floor plan here and there.
But ultimately, it’s a house being built as cheaply as possibly and as quickly as possible.
Now, I know it’s not going to be the highest quality, but I’ve definitely noticed what seems like simply sloppy work. Maybe I am being hyper critical, but, I am the one paying for it so I have a right to be. I have some concerns and seek the advice of the professionals here on the forum.
I am not a carpenter, I am not in the building trades. But I am what I like to consider “handy,” observant, and when I do something I like to do it right. So, below are some pictures of the house we are having built and I would like to point out a few concerns and you tell me if it’s worth being concerned about, and how to address it with the builder.
Also, I understand that they are still building the house and not finished, but I still want to have this looked at by others with more experience to advise me if there are things I need to confront the builder about or if I could relax. If I do confront the builder and they give me BS, how do I handle it? My agent (a dual agent), says “oh, well it’ll be inspected.” Well, I don’t trust inspectors that much. Particularly ones that regularly work with the builder.
I HIGHLY appreciate any advise or wisdom ya’ll take the time to share.
IMO, the house wrap on the house seems sloppy. I confronted the builder about this and was told “It wont be seen, and it wont hurt anything.” My question, is this a true statement, obviously it wont be seen, which to me still isn’t an excuse for it being sloppy. I look at other houses and they look like nicely wrapped Christmas gifts. Your opinions? Is this a major concern?
This window flashing to me is incorrect. The top horizontal piece is supposed to overlap the two vertical pieces. Am I right? Almost every wondow was like this. When I confronted the builder, ther said they would add a second horizontal piece, but when the siding was going up, I do not believe they ever did. Is this a problem?
Bowed studs? A Problem, to me…sloppy, your opinions?
WTF, to me wrapping a house shouldn’t be piece meal…or am I just being hypercritical….they eventually patched a small piece in here.
Vertical wrapping. Shouldn’t the seems be taped? They never were. Is this a problem?
Above and Below: When we looked at similar models being built, the support post were off of the edge a little bit, so that when they wrapped it, it would be flush with the edge. Not here. Not to mention the cracked corner. The builder said our house was done the right way and ALL of the other houses were wrong. This smelled like BS to me. They said they’d fix the cracked corner. What is the proper way to fix this corner?
Below: This just seems like a mess. The aluminum wrapping just seems sloppy, and that edge, WTF? Also, this area seems very prone to water penatration. Pros, can you advise here?
Below: Insulation compact behind A/C lines. A problem?
Also, if any of these pictures prompts you to want to see anything specifically, I have taken a rediculous amount of pictures for my future use if I ever decide to renovate anything. So I can post more if necessary.
Respectfully,
Alan B.
Replies
You can relax on a few things
Alan, I can appreciate your concerns. My thoughts:
Wrap- generally speaking everyone much rather seen a smooth tight installation but it doesnt always happen that way, specially with spec building. I would not be so concerned about the "sloppy". You are correct that it is odd that the wrap was put on vertically. the seams SHOULD be taped. there doesnt seem to be an adequate lap on the back of the house where the wrap is installed vertically. Some laps look ok and some look very poor.
Window wrap- top section should lap over the two vertical sides, i wouldnt be to concerned over that but the fact that you mentioned it, a repair was suggested and not done is very telling.
Studs- it happens, its not pretty, but its not going to hurt anything. those bowed studs should have been nailed from the exterior when the house was sheathed.
Columns/trim coil- miratec is a very common material in these parts, holds up well but those splits are signs of poor install. the trim coil is un acceptable! you should demand (nicely) this be repaired.
Insulation- compressed insulation looses its effectiveness, you are limited on how you can insulate such small cavities with 2x4 walls.
THANK YOU FOR THE REPLY!
It's definitely gives me piece of mind.
As far as the aluminum wrapping, I am not going to accept it and glad you agree! The wrapping aroung the post, seems like some miter joints would've showed a little craftsmanship. Should I see if they correct this on there own or address it now?
One other question I have is the peak/gable above the garage. It's a dead space, with no access to the inside. That entire peak is just for show (wasted space). I noticed that there is a ridge vent on it and then realized, and confirmed by looking through pictures, that there is no soffit vent for this space. Which in my logic means that air isn't going to flow, and heat will be trapped, even with the ridge vent. That space in the NC sun will get to ridiculous temps, which is just bad for obvious reasons. Am I wrong with this? Would a gable vent or something help this? Or vent the soffit above the garage by cutting out the sheathing behind the soffit there?
im in similar climate, Tn. yes a ridge vent with no soffit defeats its purpose. although a gable vent isnt the most effective it would be better than no vent. if you can get them to vent through the soffit, that would be my first request. do you have any second floor walls that back up to the garage "attic" space? if so you will fell it, specially in the summer.
Like I said, if the garage is not "conditioned", put vents in the ceiling of the garage. It will cool the garage as well as it's "attic".
The main problem I see is that the seams aren't taped, though that may not be so important where you are.
Probably the best way to vent the dummy dormer over the garage is to put vents in the garage ceiling. (This assumes that the ridge vent is actually functional, and not purely to match the rest of the house.)
The capitals are a bit sloppy, but it's not a structural problem.
With the seams being taped, the reason I thought it was a big deal was because of my location. I live on the coast where we get tropical storms, hurricanes, and heavy rain/winds.
If water were to get behind the siding, it would easily reach the sheathing without the seams being taped. Is my logic wrong here? They said they would tape them and didn't. I highly doubt they'll "redo" this unless an inpector made them do it.
I would just back out and find a new builder, but there are a few main reasons I wont. Location. The location of this home is absolutely perfect for my family. Second, unless I went with a truly custom home builder, this is probably the best there is. So, that leaves me with three options that I can think of:
One: See what they'll do if I "bluff" and say no deal unless the issues are addressed. I'd gladly accept a credit, lol.
Two: Accept it and spend the time, energy and money to fix it myself in the future
Three: Hope to hell that an inspector agrees with me
Again, thank you everyone for the replies!
The frustrating this is that I believe most of this is the crew of subcontractors I got. Seeing similar homes build by the same builder seem to not have these issues.
Okay, one other thing I noticed looking at pictures. But, the metal duct work without insulation. Suspended in the hot/humid attic, won't that condense and drip into the insulation/ceiling?
Alan, you're going to get what you pay for. The manufacturer has specific installation instructions for the house wrap. Go to the web site and check them out. One thing I have learned is that sub contractors aren't paid much when they work on new construction so they have to go fast to make $. If the GC isn't charging you much then he is probably hiring the cheapest subs he can find. You didn't say if you have a contract with the GC. Unless you absolutely have to have it I would be concerned. Sounds like the GC is just yessing you. it's probably going to cost you a lot more later to make it right. The badder you want it the badder you get it. I wouldn't rely on the inspector. Maybe hire an independent inspector now to keep an eye on things.
Who is your "agent"? Your
Who is your "agent"? Your buyer's agent? If so, then let them know that if you're not happy with the product and that you're not going to buy it. If your concerns are not adress, then do just that: don't buy it. Alternatively, you can hire a professional home inspector to review your home for quality and negotiate with your builder to incoroporate his professional advice as part of your contract . You'll be paying for this, of course, as it will be provided to you as a valuable service. I wouldn't, however, be surprised to see the builder to tell you to go fly a kite.
Personally, I find it pathetic to see a cheapskate like yourself come on this forum in order to solicit free advice from a bunch of anynomous posterswhich you obstensibily intend to use as amunition to rail against "your" builder. Be a man and present your concerns to your agent or builder face to face. If I was your builder and heard you weave in claims of "breaktime told me this...." and breaktime told me that...", I'd definitely tell you to take a hike.
Thumbs up
deadnuts wrote:
Who is your "agent"? Your buyer's agent? If so, then let them know that if you're not happy with the product and that you're not going to buy it. If your concerns are not adress, then do just that: don't buy it. Alternatively, you can hire a professional home inspector to review your home for quality and negotiate with your builder to incoroporate his professional advice as part of your contract . You'll be paying for this, of course, as it will be provided to you as a valuable service. I wouldn't, however, be surprised to see the builder to tell you to go fly a kite.
Personally, I find it pathetic to see a cheapskate like yourself come on this forum in order to solicit free advice from a bunch of anynomous posterswhich you obstensibily intend to use as amunition to rail against "your" builder. Be a man and present your concerns to your agent or builder face to face. If I was your builder and heard you weave in claims of "breaktime told me this...." and breaktime told me that...", I'd definitely tell you to take a hike.
I appreciate the opinion. I'll keep that in mind, but ask you to keep in mind that this isn't "personal." It's business and I am not a builder nor a contractor, so therefor I am going to use every resource, as a good business man does, to become as educated as possible BEFORE going into battle with negotiations and concerns. An internet forum, specifically intended for people to share knowledge with one another seems to be a great resource to me...I apologize if I was misunderstood by the purpose of this interenet forum.
You call it me being a cheapskate, sure, I call it doing research and being smart and looking to make sure I get the most for my money and that I am looking out for my family and that I know exactly what I am buying and where potential problems may be.
Also, the agent is a dual agent, meaning they represent BOTH myself and the seller. In other words, I don't trust him.
Anyway, back on topic.
I've reread the contract with my builder, and it specifically states that any problems with workmanship are to be corrected at the sellers expense. So, that's great news. Now, I just need to be able to make sure I find all problems, since, I know, as others here have reassured me, that I cannot depend on an inspector.
I do plan on emailing a few inspectors this evening with my concerns and seeing where my common denominators are.
To those who took the time to make some suggestions and recommendations, I highly appreciate it. I'd be glad to educate you in my profession anytime. I am a cop and concealed handgun instructor who believes in training people to protect themselves and dedicating my life to serving my country as a Marine Veteran, Police Officer, and Patriot. If anyone is local here in southern coastal NC, then PM me and I'll hook you up with free CHL training if interested.
Seller's Expense
Alan, I bought a house that was going up on spec. Some of the problems caused by sub par workmanship e.g. water damage, didn't show up until several years down the road. Problems that I found after moving in were addressed by the GC but he would send over a worker who would bang in a nail or two. I'd have to call again and it turned into a situation that was time consuming and as somebody said 'he just wore you down'. Central A/C installation was a joke and after several years I got tired of living with it and hired somebody to redo it right. Not saying any of this will happen to you but just be aware. I live in a development where a lot of the homes were built by the same spec builder and the others by custom builders. Guess which houses have required lots of repairs and maintenance. As a consumer you're on the right track with your questions....keep asking.....I've received a lot of excellent help on this forum. Good Luck.
Alan,
I think it looks good for a spec/trac house. Sider should have put a hem in that coil stock and the capitols should have been mitered. Bowed studs are common these days and no big deal. The plenum is insulated on the inside so it should not sweat.
Buy the crew some pizza.
Pay no attention to Deadnuts, he probably forgot to take his meds again.
KK
Pizza
KK,
I love the pizza idea and will be showing up there tomorrow with either pizza or donuts. Even though there's a few things I'm nit picking they have been working hard and ahead of schedule.
Thank you. I think my biggest concern is the coil wrapping and capitals at this point, which I emailed the agent to set up a time to meet with the builder. I am also concerned about the dead space above the garage only having a ridge vent and no soffit vent, but thats an easy fix.
Are there any other problems common that I should check or look for?
Al,
Get the sider to brake a 1"X1" with a hem to cover the edge of the coil stock. Miter the capitols.
I would get on the roof and look for "shiners" ie nails not covered. I would also make sure the shingles were nailed on the lamination line. Nailed too high and they seperate which makes for a hard fix. Look at any kick out flashings. Make sure you interior door rough opening are correct and the swing is understood. Ask to see the manual J from HVAC sub. Should be some paperwork from the energy audit also.
All the lines on the house are nice and straight which means they tried.
KK
KK,
I really appreciate that, as soon as I get an opportunity to get on the roof, I will be checking for same. I emailed the builder about the coil stock and capitals. I am also going to ask about the energy audit and manual j calc's. I never thought of any of that.
I truly appreciate it, KK!
A
While you're up on the roof (and elsewhere as well), make sure all ends, cuts and rips are sealed on the MDO trims. If they dealt with the rest as they attempted the post caps, they'll blow up like a poisonous toad sooner than later.