Not sure if I got the appropriate board or not….but here goes. I got laid off from my job, and decided I’ve had it, I”m going to start my own remodeling/construction business effective today. It’s something I’ve been thinking of for years. Over the years I accumulated a good bit of knowledge in remodeling and codes and been working side jobs. I’ve built up a few good relationships with inspectors and a few contractors that I can call on if I get a job or part of a job that I can’t do due to lack of knowledge or time.
Having said all of that, I got a lot of questions. I would like to hear from people who started out with their knees shaking (like mine are now) and grew into a successful business. I’d like to hear from people who might not mind conversing a time or two via email (my email is [email protected]). I’d like to know tips and things you used to get your name out there so that the phone would ring with jobs to do. I am basically starting out with nothing. No truck, a few good tools, a lot of knowledge, a handful of about $400 and a wife and two small kids. I MUST BE SUCCESSFUL. I’m curious about work insurance, how much should I have? What is the best way to find good yet inexpensive health insurance?
I put an ad in todays small newspaper, cost $44 for one week. Don’t know if I wasted my money or what. I just need to know how to get my name out there fast so the phone will ring and I can start reaping profits and replace my lost income. Anyone willing to help and offer advice, and share their success story, is much appreciated. I am in the Harrisburg PA area and all my work is good, honest and QUALITY.
Replies
Pyroman,
Get a job and support your family. Don't delay on that. Once you have that job, take a few deep breaths and write your business plan. These thing take alot of time. It takes years to be an overnight success. I don't mean to be harsh on you, but take a look at what you are doing. You are severly under capitolized. Here is my advise:
1. stop what you are doing
2. take care of your family
3. take the time to educate yourself in business
4. put together your plan and gather your capitol
5. when the time is right - make your move.
good luck and take care
dl
DL, the thing is, I've been working a job all my life and discovered that my career isn't what I really want. What I really want is to be in remodel/renovations. I am burned out in my career. To be exact, I"m a computer programmer who made $52K/yr. Why on earth would I want to leave that profession? Because there is nothing to it anymore. I'm 34yrs old, I"m still young and hopefully young enough yet that I can do a business. I"m not looking for an overnight success, I know it takes work and lots of it. The other thing, too, is that there is so much work out there and not enough to get it done. If anything I can fill the void of doing smaller jobs, make $25 to $35/hr and try to make it out there. If not now, then when do I go for it?
Get a job working for a remodeling company so you can start bringing in some income right away. Then plan out your own business, and when you have the capital and tools needed, as well as all the great experience you will gain from working for a remodeling company, you can go out on your own.
Good Luck & have fun!
Ditto what deadload said and then some.
I'm in central pa as well, and I can tell you that there is alot of competition at your level of capitalization. The desperation that you will experience in this situation will not be good for you, your family, the industry in general or your competion in my humble opinion. Get a job in construction and keep up the side work, until you have the essentials. Email me your resume, I am always in the market for a good allaround carp.
Your enthusiasm will take you a long way, but I have found that excellent financial skills are the most important indicator of a persons success in construction. I don't mean to be disrespectful but having two kids and four hundred bucks in your savings would not denote excellent fiscal abilities in the eyes of most people.
Even a successful construction business is a roller coaster ride in terms on weekly, monthly or even quarterly income. Having some capital allows a successful company to make wise business decisions. Throw in some employees and business expenses, and an undercapitalized venture will put you in the bankruptcy notifications in the Patriot fairly quickly. I've been in business going on thirteen years, and I'm not where I thought I'd be but I'm comfortable with my progress. This site has helped me alot. Keep reading here, particularly the business posts. There is a wealth of information here from people who have lived your dream(/nightmare?)
After you get through the first year we will teach you the secret handshake and give you the magic bidding wand!
Tom
Ditto to all the advice. The way I did it isn't much diffeerent that how you are starting out. But we are subs, not GC or Remodelers. Makes a big difference. Started w/about 3-4000 dollars. No truck, no trailer, etc. Sold my first job and had to fast talk about a 2 week delay to buy a truck and a trailer. lol Took 3 months to sell the first job. Grossed 19k the first year. Not enough for a family. But I worked at night for a trucking company. I drove They always need trailer unloaders. Usually on swing/graveyard. The national firms pay pretty well. UPS would be about 15-20/hr. But short shifts. Gotta keep the cash flow coming in for your family. But the family will keep you going so that you can sell and work during the day. When I would not want to roll out of bed in the morning would ask myself how bad do you want it? That got me up and off. The regular cash flow gives you more bargaining power. If you don't HAVE to have the job you can walk away with a clear mind. That is transmitted to the client telepathically. It's called desperation. Very bad. Good luck. Take care of your family first.
Ditto to all of the above. I left a corporate job in the late 80's after a plant closure; end of good salary, bennies, vacations, holidays etc. Kid was out of the nest, but DW employed in a solid profession.
I worked hard, but made no significant income for nearly 5 years. And now that I'm busy and can pick my jobs within a solid customer base, I have little time off, work quite a few holidays and the benefits are not really financial.
The advice you've been given about undercapitalization is probably the biggest one, because when you get to the business pace necessary to support a family, you're going to be dealing with some cash-flow issues that can go south on you real quick if you underbid a job, or a customer is really slow to pay or you get sick or injured. Be late paying up your local yard a time or two and you'll find yourself on a "cash only' basis.
You also didn't mention anything about getting licensed and insured and bonded; I don't know about PA., but in my state, for a newbie, that would suck up that $400 and then some before you've driven a single nail. Work on your own without the above and somebody rats you out and you might get a fine that could tip you over.
I agree with the others; get a job to feed the troops while you prepare for success and, what can be, a very rewarding way of life.
Other than that, all the very best to you!
"I don't have a truck or anything..."
"I have a handful of $400..."
"I must be succesful..."
Sorry kid, you don't have a chance!
"I spent $44 for a one week advertisement. Did I waste my money?...."
Yes, you did. You'll be lucky if you get 3 phone calls, and none will probably pan out. I know, cause I use to do the same thing. What will land you jobs is "word of mouth" from satisfied customers....period!
Getting those early customers is hard to come by. You would be much better off typing up a flyer and printing up a 100 or so copies on a copier for about $7 and then passing those out in your neighborhood. This method will probably generate about the same number of phone calls ( 3) that you will get from the actual newspaper ad; but at least you'll spend less money advertising this way. Posting a sign in the yard of the home you are remodeling helps. Having signage painted on your truck or van (which you don't have?) also helps people see you are in business. Get the word out through friends, and rely on referrals from them and other contractors that know you and are too booked up for the "small stuff" which is all you will get in the beginning. Do good work and word of mouth will get out; but this takes time.
Waiting on time to slowly build up your reputation won't work if all you got is $400 in the bank. It takes longer than 2-3 weeks; which is about how far that $400 will last you.
I agree with all the others that you need to take care of your family first. I would suggest that you instead go back to computer programing and start saving up some money. Save enough money that you could at the very least, survive financially for 6 months if you did'nt make a dime in your remodeling business.
Better yet, save enough to last you a whole year.
After saving up the money, I would then proceed to work as an apprentice carpenter for a GC to gain experience. I would keep my computer job for now, cause no way you are gonna make $50 K a year as someone's helper in the trades.
But, you will eventually still need this trade experience or you will lose your shirt ( and knash your teeth!) when trying to bid jobs on your own without having the knowledge that such experience affords you ...this is a cold, hard fact.
There is " bou-coup" bucks involved when establishing a LEGITIMATE business...licensing, filing of state business registration forms, city registration forms, insurance concerns, money for acquiring the necessary tools, establishing a line of credit with various suppliers. etc. etc. plus having to finance a job that you may have to wait a while before getting paid....
Like I said, $400 won't begin to touch this...and no decent vehicle to carry supplies or to cart off work debris? Without a truck or a van, you are already dead in the water. This is no way to start a construction type business.
Think too about what kind of the remodeling business you want to do. Currently, I do it all, ( roofing, bathroom/ kitchen remodels, vinyl siding, door & window installations, room renovations, additions, concrete work, plumbing, electrical, etc.) and this requires even more tools, knowledge (and headaches) than if I were to limit myself to only one area of expertise.
Say for example, I decided to instead to specialize only in door and window installations. I would not need half the tools I now own and transporting the tools needed just for this type of work only would become easier. Less set-up and tear down time involved. Also, less anxiety involved with the bidding process. Because, unlike general remodeling, where a 100 things could be involved and could possibly go wrong, the bidding variables associated with window/door work is much less involved and therefore becomes routine; making it easier to bid each time.) I personally am thinking about specializing in the very near future for the very same reasons I just mentioned.
Just so you know, I went on my own 20 months ago. Before I "took the plunge"I had more than a year's salary set aside before quitting my former job as an industrial union carpenter ( I was an 8 year journeyman) and my wife is and has always been steadily employed as a schoolteacher. Even with all the varied experience I had as a journeyman, and the added financial security of my wife's job, this new venture has not by any means been an easy one so far. I'd be lying if I said I haven't seriously considered ( many times in fact) about getting my old job back.
In these past 20 months, I have had some really slow times coupled with some good months. Word of mouth about my workmanship is finally just now starting to pay off. The phone is now ringing, and I am not advertising at all anymore. But up til now, it's been pretty slow. BTW, Newspaper ads never got me a single job. I had one ad that ran every week for 8 weeks....received 3 phone calls total; and what they wanted was more handy-man type stuff. ( "Could you hang a vanity mirror for me in my bathroom?" that sorta thing.)
Don't give up your dream, but do be realistic. Running your own business takes a lot of time ( WAY MORE TIME THAN A REGULAR 8 HOUR JOB!), effort, know-how, and money. If you are short on any one of the 4 when going into this venture, your chance of survival will be very slim indeed.
Davo
LOL If I could save up enough money to last me a whole year. I sure as hell would not start a carpentry buisness in Central PA. I would go to the Carribean. And take a few months to think about it.
O.K., so right now your at the middle of the swing. You've been through the Denial, Anger, Shock, Fear, Frustration, Confusion, and Stress. If not, get over it, you have been layed off and there is nothing you can do about it. It wasn't your fault, you did not fail at your job, your company failed you. What you need now is energy. You've creatively chosen to change careers. You're skeptical about your ability to suceede and it doesn't sound to me like you've accepted your career change idea as viable. You've even gotten impatient and ran an add that is pretty much worthless.
You need to combine hope with energy to overcome the anxiety and turn it into enthusiasm. No matter what the previous posts say, YOU CAN DO THIS and you have made the first step in the right direction by asking for help. There is hard work and there are long hours ahead of you but you will make it.
Get yourself a "Taxi" job. Something to get you buy while you work towards your business. Keep it simple and non-stressfull if possible. 7-11 or McDonalds is not out of the question if it gives you a feeling that you are still contributing to the household. This will help to fight off the depression if things dont go just right at first.
Now, heres your first stop in the business education process - http://www.sba.gov/ Next find out where the nearest sba office is and go visit. There is tons of free information available and possibly mentors that teach small classes that you can fit into your schedule.
Do your business plan and don't fluff it up just to get a loan. You're only lying to yourself and when that happens you will fail. Follow the rules and follow the plan, it will work for you only as hard as you work for it.
Get involved in the community.. NOW... You're young, volunteer you skills for community projects, coach a little league team, soccer team, whatever, but get involved and start making contacts.
Get your state contractors license - Make yourself credible, without one, other subs in your trade will blow you off as a bozo with a hammer. You need these folks on your side because it is not uncommon to refer another contractor when someone can't handle the work. Some of your best jobs will come to you this way.
Join the local contractors association - Make business contacts, know when contracts are comming up, etc.
Join the Chamber of Commerce - Get to know the folks that are in business in your area and let them get to know you... Open up but don't BS.
Bottom Line - Hard Work, Hard Work, Hard Work, Hard Work. If you want it bad enough that will not scare you. If the fact that physical and mental work scare you ... go back to IT and work at a help desk answering phones and reading scripted responses. Because all of the nay sayers are correct, you won't make it.
Chin up, head held high, shoulders straight. You are good enough to do this. Obviously your wife thinks so or she'd be walking on you right now. Think about that!
Sincerely
Steve Schefer, Senior IT Consultant, CGI USA., Salary - 139,000.00 per annum. Age - 48
Reitrement date: July 31st 2002
Re-Employment date: August 1st 2002
Employer; Steve Schefer Custom Cabinetry
Salary....... it all depends on me.
P.S. I've spent the last nine months working on putting this business together. The only thing I lack at the moment is my General Contractors license but I am testing for that in a couple of weeks. I've come to this site and FWW for advice several times.
Steve - in Northern California
The advice I"m getting is as expected, 99% on the side of "go back to my old job and take care of the family," and 1% encouragement. I"m not trying to sound rude to those who gave advice in any way. IN fact, I respect you wholeheartedly and anticipated such responses. IN my original posting I left out some info in the interest of brevity. Let me elaborate some....
I've been doing tons of side jobs over the last 6 years. I got every one of them either by word of mouth, or from another IT friend of mine who just likes to build and does it on the side in the evenings and he's thrown stuff my way. I've had fairly good word of mouth advertising as it is. It could be better. I suspect it has not been better because people know i"m not doing it full time but on an "as I can" basis.
I am very good in the big four: Plumbing, Electric, HVAC, and framing. I know probably 80% of all the relevant and important building code rules in each of those areas. But while I"m very good in those areas, I realize there are some things I can't yet do and therein lies where subs can really help me. I believe in QUALITY WORK, good work, guaranteed work. With that in mind, I've built up relationships over the last few years with a plumbing contractor, HVAC contractor, and electrical contractor, as well as relationships with several building inspectors and one electrical inspector whom I"m sold totally on. All of the 3 contractors said they'd back me up and be my subs when I need them, and their work is most excellent and will allow me to boast a reputation for quality.
Since my original posting I've had my HVAC sub offer to sell me a 93 Chev van currently used in their fleet. They want to sell for a new one. It's in good condition for what I'd need it for, has shelves,and hooks and all inside. I just need to buy a ladder rack. It is a deal I can likely afford in some way as I continue to find funds to run such as SBA funds.
Also, since my original posting, I already "won" my first job doing an entire drywall job of a house as of yesterday evening. I also have lined up 2 more major drywall jobs plus a 200amp upgrade and a bathroom tiling job all within the last 36 hours.
Understand this.....I"m sick of IT and I LOVE CONSTRUCTION REMODELING. I have the drive, zeal and determination to become a name recognized with quality and a job done right with a guarantee. My passion is to build. I took a wrong turn going into IT. When I walked into that house last night that I have to drywall and finish, I KNEW I was about to do what I am excited and happy about. Will it get old? No way. It doesn't get old when it's something you know you have had a continuous passion for. For too long I let my IT job stop me due to the paycut I'd take. But now I"ve been laid off, it's an opportunity that I might've kept postponing for me to finally do something different.
Yes I"m undercapitalized, but I"m working on SBA loans. I see money as my only hump right now. I got all my other ducks lined up, there is no doubt I can get a job done, and I will.
So to Steve Schefer, thank you for you wonderful encouragement. To all the others, know that I believe in your advice to and am not discarding it at all. I need to take your advice, and Steves, and make a plan that works and gets me that job that I know I really want to do the rest of my life.
Please feel free to keep posting advice, I do value it.
"It wasn't your fault, you did not fail at your job, your company failed you."
Steve - you must know pyroman personally. Also if you think 140k is alot of money, you are mistaken. Also, you senior title has absolutely no bearing on how well your cabinetry business will do.
I'm somehow getting the impression that IT people think construction is for less intelligent people. That just anyone can do it. Between my partner and I we acquired three degrees and 11 years of construction management experience before we started. It was still hell, and it is still a fight every day to stay in the game. My favorite part of the month is getting my local news letter from the contractors association to see who cancelled their subscription because they failed. Another one down I say to myself. Im less excited that they failed as I am that I haven't.
Pyroman - I'm holding my ground, you approach to business is reckless, your odds for failure are high and your family stands to pay the price with you.
It's not all about you.
dl
On the contrary, DL, I don't think construction workers are less intelligent than IT people. To me there is a far more equal amount of technical knowledge one needs to know in construction. After all, who wants a floor that sags, a house that falls down, a heating system that doesn't deliver in the winter time due to poor design, a roof that leaks, or a window that is crooked? Oh and let's not forget the proverbial poorly designed electrical circuit that trips every time you turn on the toaster, coffee maker and microwave for morning breakfast.......
Cheers
>To me there is a far more equal amount of technical knowledge one needs to know in construction.
"far more equal"? Huh?
Whatever it means, here's what it started me thinking about. Technical knowledge and business knowledge have no correlation. People can have either, both, or neither. What the 99% here are commenting on is your business knowledge. We don't know what it is. If you've never been the proprietor of a business, you probably don't know what your business knowledge is either. If you've never been the proprietor of a business, you're in for one helluva education, because working for someone else with a regular paycheck does absolutely nothing to prepare you for the harsh realities of running a business. It is quite the slap in the face and kick in the pants. My recommendation is--regardless of which path you follow--to take a course with SCORE or whomever is in your area on the basics of operating a business.
As Far As construction Knowledge : An assumption in construction, when you are young, is that you are working as an apprentice for a paycheck, and the knowledge to go out on your own. The reality is, you will never get the information, knowledge or money that way. In fact you will be damn lucky. If you get a good reference. There is no way to do it, but to jump in with both feet. But don't be stupid either.
As far as technical knowledge goes: Just because you are not an electrician doesn't mean a little knowledge of electricity won't help. It might keep you from doing something stupid.
As far as Buisness knowledge goes . I was readin a good spread in Builder magizine. The construction industry has the highest Failure rate in all of Buisness. In the past 10 years, the rate has been over 5% higher consistantly. the biggest reasons, Insufficiant profits, Industry weakness, lack of buisness Knowledge, buisness conflicts, inadequate sales.
Sales that's another good one, Sales knowledge: You have to be able to sell products and yourself. And you had better know who your selling it to. Sometimes i feel like I don't know. However, I rarely miss a job, that i thought i was going to get.
Well said. I grew up the son of a General Building Contractor with specialties in plumbing and heating. His father was in the same trade. My brother is now in the same trade. I worked with my dad every summer and many weekends when growing up. I joined the Navy to see the world and 20 years later retired. My forte' was communications so continuing in the Information Technology field was a natural. After 10 years its turned into nothing more than a bunch of smoke and mirrors and certainly not something I want to be a part of so I am returning to the trades. My dad always said, stick to the trades, people will always need a place to live and if you're honest and hardworking, you'll always have a job. The trades job market is certainly no worse off than the IT job market.Steve - in Northern California
Steve,
DeadLoad is a construction term, you should look it up.
dl
Huh, was their something I missed about a dead load or are your really a live load or maybe a combination of the two. Nope couldn't be a combination of the two, you never change.Steve - in Northern California
Deadload, your name suits you well. Have you ever thought of taking prozak, you are an extremely depressed person and need help. Steve - in Northern California
By all means do up a business plan. Don't figure this is so easy. There are a lot of guys out there like you and inless you have a ton of drive and know how to supervise others my bet is you're just going to scrape buy always robbing peter to pay paul. You can't imagine the strain it will put on your marriage and your family. Quick! get a job and then plan how you should best approach this. (you probably won't listen, lord knows I didn't)
I'm assuming you want to be a one man band. If you have the support and endorsment of people in the field , and they respect you like you say. You can't lose. Just don't be naive. You can get a lot of heartburn. When the politics start.
It's all about money and who gets it.. Only you know what is best for you. But If I had a family to support. I wouldn't be doing it. It is too unstable. And No matter how good a certain hourly rate sounds. If you only work a month out of the year , Your hourly rate is about .50 cents. It is no fun working to pay your insurance so you can be ready "IF" work comes your way. You must have profit if your buisness is to grow. If it doesn't grow it dies. Maybe you should sit down and decide how much work you have actually been promised, this year.
Also, I think that guys who specialize do better. If they can specialize, when the economy is strong . But then when it is slow you want to be able to take what ever comes your way. Unfortunately, everybody thinks of you as the Gutter Guy. Who knows his buisness when it comes to gutter, but what the hell could he possibly know about drywall. so be carefull what you tell people.
The jack of all trades and handymen get the big jobs and don't make the big bucks. And the established GC's don't need the small jobs. And once you become known as the no job too small guy. That is who you will be. But who are you? Who do you employ? they don't need you , you need them . That is why the computer Industry is leveling off for you probably.
Workman's comp doesn't figure in to the one man band , neither do the big jobs. And big dogs aren't going to jump for little dogs, when your regular concete guy bails out , you have a signed contract and materials on site. Going bad because you can't frame the garage for another month. Who pays you while your waiting. because you can't make a chedule because every job needs somthing. If your materials even come in on time. can you get them cheap enough to actually be competitive. Sounds like fun don't it! Good Luck if you even get this.
Any day, I put my hammer in my hand, is a good day! Usually lol!
You've been given alot of good advice and considerations here. I started out at the age of 24, not 34, and it was tough. No wife or kids at the time, either. I think you can have what it is that you say you want, but I just don't think that it can likely happen at the pace you may desire. My best advice for you considering your current life situation is to take the advice you've been given here by those who've been there, done that. I think your best bet is to go knock on some doors and get a job with an established business. Show them and yourself what you've got. Cut your teeth there and see where it takes you. I admire your tenacity and wish you the very best in your endeavor. Hope you'll post back and let us all know how you're doing.
Cash flow is the biggest problem for most new businesses. Recommendations are to have at least 3 months and up to 1 year's worth of cash on hand. If you haven't saved up more than $400 on a regular salary, what's your plan for groceries on an erratic income? Do you know your weekly cash requirements--for food, clothing, rent, debt you'd incur for the business, materials you'd have to front?
Everyone I know who has started a business and been successful has done so despite advice against starting the business. Of course, those who started a business and did not succeed also got the same advice. So what makes one work and the other not? Takes more than determination and good looks (though a coupla guys here may say that was the biggest part of it for them! Ha ha ha).
>What is the best way to find good yet inexpensive health insurance?
There is no such thing as inexpensive health insurance.