I hear this topic kicked around on jobsites all the time and it never seems to be decided. So I’m wondering what you guys think. I’m sitting here looking over the Gemplers catalog getting ready to order a bunch of winter clothes and what-not. I see some boots I like too, but they are steel toe.
Do steel toes boots really make your toes colder during the winter? I can see arguments both ways so I really don’t know the answer. We’re talking about an uninsulated boot in a New England winter. I prefer to rely on sock choices for insulation because I can adjust it according to the weather and it’s one less layer to try to dry out of the boot at night.
What say you all?
Replies
Wore em for years and years andnever had them make my toes cold.
Side note: Did you watch myth busters the other night when they were trying to bust the myth about steel toe boots cutting your toes off?
http://bootliquor.com/
Naw, didn't see that one. What'd they come up with?
I caught that episode of mythbusters - pretty convincing experiments.
I agree with you too, I wear steel toe boots always (even in northern Alberta where it gets real cold). Never had a problem, and the steel saved my toes on more than one occaison.
I don't think steel toes make yer feet any colder but i haven't worn them for awhile as a lot of boot makers now offer a composite toe thats a lot lighter. I just got some new CAT boots that are as light as sneakers but they still have toe protection and a sole plate.
cheers
Rik
I've never used a steel toe boot before but I've thought about it being cold also. I heard flip flops are good in the winter also using a spray on sock.....;-)
Joe Carola
Edited 11/13/2005 10:44 am ET by Framer
There are some Nonmetal "hard toes" now..I have a pair of Herman Survivers that have a fiber/plastic toe..
But I digress, I never had a cold toe problem BECAUSE of steel toes, it was just so damm cold, no matter what..you'd have cold toes!
Roofing now, OSHA doesn't require us to be steel clad, but I am guessing YOU do need either steel ot the hard plastic to conform..esp. witha boomer onsite..they can run over toes right quick.
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
" you? YOU!? Are actually listening to that CRAP????
How about? going to werk, how about"...I can't do it, it aint fair..but
HOW ABOUT THAT REZ GUY? UH HUH? ...He ain't Silesien I bet....wimp
Honestly dude, I don't think I've owned a pair of steel toe boots in a couple years. I do think we are supposed to have them per OSHA. I buy boots that fit good and look good.... I don't really care if they have marshmallow toes... if I like 'em, I'm buying 'em. I found a pair of the new Carhartt boots that I like and they're steel toe. I think I'll probably buy them and if I find that they're cold I'll just save 'em for the spring or something.
Last week I scored a pair of Wolverines, and like you said, look good..feel good SOLD!!
The first thing I noticed was weight..man they are light ( no steel) and second thing was, I USE my foot as a lever or a lifter some times..I had 2 2'x10' copper pans to send up the scaffold ( nested, about 40 lbs)...I USED to set them on my toes while I regripped for the shove up...um, not no more..LOL
I coulda cut off a toe..Grant works in his shop in sandals..brave man I tell ya. Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
" you? YOU!? Are actually listening to that CRAP????
How about? going to werk, how about"...I can't do it, it aint fair..but
HOW ABOUT THAT REZ GUY? UH HUH? ...He ain't Silesien I bet....wimp
Re: Working in the shop in sandals, that is not brave, it is stupid. How bad can wearing protective shoes or boots be? I always wear my steel toes
Being as you know neither the man or his shop and what he does, calling it stupid is pretty stupid in it self. Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
HOW ABOUT THAT REZ GUY? UH HUH? ...He ain't Silesien I bet....wimp
Being a clutz prone to dropping things... like oily engine blocks or transmissions... I usually keep a pair of steel toes somethings (shoes or boots) around when I am working in the shop. When I lived in the midwest (Chicago area), uninsulated steel toed boots and shoes were colder than just about anything else I could wear. I was also standing on bare concrete most of the time.
Rebuilding my home in Cypress, CA
Also a CRX fanatic!
They can contribute. I've never thought it was a great deal until I spent a few years in Montana and got to see what real cold was all about. Maybe obvious, matters more the colder it gets.
Someone mentioned the variant of the non metal safety toe. I've got a couple pair of Danners that have a ceramic toe like that. Awesome winter boot. If I have to work outside when its snowing I grab them.
POLICE/MILITARY View Image FORT LEWIS NMT 10" 600 GRAM MEN'S/WOMEN'S
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"If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man." - Mark Twain
Those Danners are very good boots. I've owned a couple of pair. The best boot I've ever had(still have) are Matterhorns. I keep them put up now cause they would be a waste for what I do most of the time. Most expensive boots I've ever bought but the internal metatarsol guard saved me from a trencher rolling over my foot once. So they paid for themselves in one day.
The only difference in mine and the one in the link is mine doesn't have that "tiger toe" thing sticking out.
http://www.shoestoboot.com/moreinfo.cfm?Product_ID=715&Category=162
http://bootliquor.com/
That's odd, and maybe the world is just full of funky shaped paws. I absolutely can't stand the way Matterhorns feel on me. But there's lots who swear by 'em. I kind of have flippers more than feet anyway. But I agree, the Danners are well made, and oh are they spendy. I got lucky as heck, bought one set, got the second free. Wooooooo! Man do I find the bargains or what."If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man." - Mark Twain
2 for 1? That's a once in a life time. Now that you brought up Danners you have me looking again. Have you seen these puppies?
http://www.danner.com/products.asp?catid=11&prodid=2238
http://bootliquor.com/
Danners... 220 clams??? Waaay toooo rich for my blood...
Two things I never go cheap on is footwear and firearms. If my feet are happy then that's all I need to justify them. And they will outlast most other boots because of the material used. That alone justifies the price. I make my living on my feet, I don't want them miserable.
http://bootliquor.com/
With all that bogus money your printing, price shouldn't even be a issue, just pay cash oh and don't forget to wear the dread locks when you do it.
ROAR! You know me well.
http://bootliquor.com/
naw, but they look good. Actually, it was these forums where everyone and their dog loves Redwings that got me to try a pair of them. Man. The Danners are a great winter boot but for everyday, you couldn't peel those Redwings from me. It's like a second skin . . . with a steel shank and steel toe ;-)"If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man." - Mark Twain
I just picked up a new pair of Redwings 468's I love em. I'm weird about this stuff I'll go forever and not buy any, then buy two or three pairs within a month. Drives the wife nuts. But I wear em so that's the important part. I haven't worn steel toes in awhile not because I don't want to just because I haven't found a style I like that has them. But those Danners look tempting. Might have to make them an early Christmas present to myself.
http://bootliquor.com/
I agree that Matterhorn is a great boot. When I was in the Marine Corps with an ECW (extreme cold weather) unit, I had a pair of Danner's that were identical to those Matterhorns except that they had some Gore-Tex side panels instead of all leather. Great boots, I went through three sets of Vibram soles on those uppers before finally retiring them after wearing the toes out during construction years later.
That's probably where I should be looking for some winter work boots. Thanks for the reminder.
Steel toed boots made my toes much colder.
I have a problem with cold feet anyway, so I noticed the difference big time.
Worst when you are on cold concrete all day, for some reason.
Be kinder than necessary, for everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle.
Steel toes do make my toes noticeably colder.
Try good woolen hiking socks.
Hadn't noticed that steel toes make my feet colder. I'm in Florida now but used to work farther north. I can say that there is a small trick which seems to make any boots warmer. Between pairs of socks, always pays to wear liner and outer in cold weather, slip a plastic sandwich bag over your toes. The bag shouldn't be too big or be pulled up too far. Just cover the toes and maybe an inch or so of the instep.Seems to make for warmer feet without causing too much sweating or overheating. Cheap, the bags can be reused many times, and IMHO fairly effective.
One other thing I noticed with cold toes... if your feet start off a little cold, they will get ALOT cold. It's always helped to get my feet warm before putting on the boots. I think it just helps keep the circulation up enough to maintain warmth. Rebuilding my home in Cypress, CA
Also a CRX fanatic!
Along those lines, sometimes I throw my sox in the dryer for about 4 minutes just prior to putting them and my shoes on and leaving the house for work.
Here is a q for the general public:
Do waterproof boots make your feet get hot and sweat?
Man I gotta disagree with some of you guys and your methods to keep your feet warm... big time. I must have wacky feet or something.
4LORN1's plastic bags would have me with sweaty cold feet in a matter of minutes. Same goes with socks fresh out of the dryer.... my feet would get hot and sweaty and then cool down outside and leave me with wet cold feet again.
I like wool or polypropylene socks in the winter because they wick the water off your feet and won't hold on to it. That's why I don't like insulated boots much, the insulation stays damp and actually makes my feet colder if it doesn't dry out all the way at night. Gore-tex as a waterproofer is a must though. Gore-tex is a must for me because it doesn't allow water in, but lets water vapor escape. But sometimes I find that even my $50 Sealskin socks can't keep up at times and I still end up with cold feet from sweat cooling down.
On winter mornings, I try to keep my feet cool and dry from the time I put my socks on until I get out of the truck. Cool (not cold) feet = dry feet = happy feet for me. Using the floor heat in the truck is a big no-no for me on the ride to work too. If my feet are dry, with moderate insulation, they'll stay comfortable all day long.
My problem arises when I'm working hard up on the deck and my feet are actually sweating. Then I go stand on frozen ground at a set of horses for an hour and I'm just doomed if I'm not wearing a system that's pulling that water away from my feet.j
So to answer you question about water proof boots making my feet sweat... well, it depends. An all leather boot that is waterproof is bad news for me.... I'll sweat in it and freeze... might as well be leaking. But a Gore-tex and leather boot works well because the water vapor from sweat can escape and the muddy puddles and what not stay out.
buy your boots ####size bigger.2+3=7
The bags only cover the toes.
Sorry, I missed that. All I could think about was this kid in our neighborhood growing up. We called him "Frankie Breadbags" cuz his mom would send him to the bus stop with bread bags coming up out of his boots, with his pants tucked into them, and an elastic band to keep the whole mess together. Too funny.
No problem.A few people I know camp with what is known as 'vapor barrier', VB, clothing. They make great claims that it is great stuff as an adjunct to insulation. The idea is that once your body gets to some level of moisture it will stop sweating and the sweat evaporating carries off lots of heat. Sounds great. Except my body doesn't work that way. I don't stop sweating. I think I'm designed for high temperatures where sweating saves lives. I end up with pools of sweat under the plastic, I have been told I can be heard sloshing, with little trickles running down my ankles and wrists. Soaking my socks and gloves. Great way to get frostbite. So far the only VB clothing that works for me is the sandwich bags over the toes. I can't even wear latex or plastic gloves for very long. After an hour or so mine start looking like water balloons. Even the sandwich bags only makes sense for really cold days. Round here about four days a year.
Here's a tip to help keep feet warm in the winter... antiperspirant!
I bicycle a bit and since the feet don't get the same flexing as when walking, I've found that my feet get cold much faster on a bicycle.
We don't all sweat the same, but often my feet will get cold simply because they've gotten a little sweaty. Moisture can't get out of a shoe very easily and so my feet get cold. I once tried baggies as a wind block. It was a disaster. My feet were never colder.
So, for those who sweat easily and profusely (like me) try a little antiperspirant on the toesies. It really works.
-Don
In regards to the sweating freezing thing. I learned a long time ago working in Canada and Montana etc. That a good pair of insulated water wicking lined boots is the ticket. I forget what they call the liner but it works good. And I also learned to wear one pair of medium duty socks. If the boots are insulated that's all I need. And believe me my feet are capable of getting cold. If I buy the right boots for the elements and wear them the way they are designed I have comfortable toasty toes all winter.
http://bootliquor.com/
Note that I said put the sox in the dryer for 4 minutes... The idea is to warm them but not get them hot. And sometimes when it's really cold, I wear liner sox - I think they are poly-somethin-or-another... We don't see cold weather here but for about a month at the most so I'm not as up on all the cold weather survival methods. I did go to Mass once for work and remember how cold it was - it was single digits during the day and we just don't get that here in NC...
Your point about gortex is a good one. My prob is just finding boots that are comfee on my old flat feet. Just about any boots I get I end up putting Dr. Sholes inserts in there and that helps some - not the gells though... I had several pairs of Rockport "Rocs" work boots: they weighed about 3 OZs each and man I loved them for comfort - soles didn't wear great though - and now they don't sell those anymore - and the ones they do have are waterproof - leather I think. I have some steel toed Wolverines now that are OK, but they just don't measure up to the comfort and the light weight of the old Rockports - the weight of the W. obviously partially due to the steel toes. I also have recently had a few pairs of Timberlines but they aren't comfortable at all.
So - gortex, composite toes, light weight, super comfort - mid height - mid priced - hummm, I guess I want it all. Mean time my DW keeps saying "you need to go the the foot doctor (in a high, whiney, authoritative tone..)... :-)
I think I just have exceptionally sweaty feet then. I'll go to work and swear my feet were cold all day... get home and have sweaty socks. I really still haven't figured it out yet.
It doesn't help that I'm super picky about boots too. I've got really weird narrow feet so a lot of boots don't fit good. I do the aftermarket liner thing too. If the boots are too wide my feet slip around left and right and I've had the entire ball of my foot blister over a few times during a forced march in the Marines. Messy, messy.
I'm thinking foot comfort is pretty specific to the individual, I guess.
Oh... and your right... Rockport made some very comfortable boots and shoes. I don't think I've even done more than glance at a pair in a few years though. They seem to have sold out a bit in quality.
living in central new York we get cold and snow I always wear steel toe and never found them to be any colder than other footwear about ten years ago I started buying lacrosse 3/4 high overshoe/boot and they are awesome they keep my feet warm and you can slip them on and off easily when working in someone's house since using them I haven't bought a pair of winter boots
Waterproof boots...No, cold & sweat...
I always wear steel toe ... and never noticed my toes freezing due to them.
I do have a pair of insulated steel toe boots for working all day in ice and snow.
I usually wear the regular stel toes unless it's real wet or muddy though.
or ... gonna be outside all day ... and it's gonna be at or under 15 deg or so all day.
otherwise ... like ya said ... me feet sweat when I'm busy and working.
if I stood still ... they'd be alot colder.
Jeff
Buck Construction
Artistry In Carpentry
Pittsburgh Pa
So yer saying I'm standing still too much? ;)
Interesting discussion on footwear here, heres my 2Cents.
I wear Redwings #914 goretex noninsulated.
Real sloppy mud sucking jobs, redwings with 2 sized larger rubber yellow pullovers with the plastic bags you get your groceries in over my redwings to ease the on and off of the yellows.
Little muddy that doesn't mean I,ll be spending the whole day in slop construction rubbers with clips for fastening., not the totes brand.
Exterme cold a pair of insulated chippawas, I have a pair of insulated Danners, but hate to waste them on construction work.
Never wear pack boots as there to damm heavy, feet sweat, and they just fatigue me at the end of day. Plus they always seem to pull socks down to bottom of boots. Good for ice fishing snowmobiling and still hunting.
Smart wool socks and poly liners for winter, dry feet are happy feet.
If you find that your running that lift alot for extended periods of time nothing will suck the heat out of your feet like that cold steel deck, try cutting some styrofoam to fit floor of your loader and duck tape down.
I think you might want to try the slip on rubbers,as they give you a layer away from the wet snow etc. and are easy to get on and off real fast.
As to the original ? on steel toes, can't say never owned a pair.
Danusan11, You hit on two points that are important to me: too much weight and slip on rubbers.
If the total weight of the boot is too heavy, my lower back will hurt. I do ANYTHING to keep my back from hurting. This last year, I have to admit that I even left my workboots in the truck and started wearing athletic shoes. Now I'm hooked on them and I'm dreading the cold, which might force me to add some weight.
The slip on rubbers might be the ticket. In the coldest weather, I used to stay quite comfortable if I put a pair of pullon rubber boots over my leathers. I had to leave them unbuckled to breath, but they kept me toasty. That extra layer of rubber is quite effective.
blue
ps Side note to Danusan. I've been waiting to see you post in here. This is the first post I've seen since Cal's fest. I just wanted to let you know that I talked about your property to my investor/syndicator and we both agreed that it didn't fit into our planned scope. My experience is primarily residential and we are continuing our search for residential developmental propertys.
Hope you do well with your piece. I was through the area last week and I agree, it is prime commercial property!
Re: "If the total weight of the boot is too heavy, my lower back will hurt."Look into orthopedic insoles. I used to move furniture and I'm on my feet a lot. Improper support of the feet can make the back hurt. Throws everything out of line. Time and again I have had friends who tried everything for their back and only got long term relief when they got orthotic shoes and/or insoles fitted. They make a big difference. To get the best effect get a set or two, usually once on set is fitted they can recreate them more inexpensively so two isn't much more than one, fitted by a professional. Some insurance companies will cover it for back problems. Even if it costs a couple of hundred treat yourself by getting a set professionally fitted. Once you find out what proper support feels like you can get cheap by seeing what DIY and over the counter insoles will do.Life is too short to let a sore back control you.
Thanks 4Lorn1, I'll look into them.
blue
Blue thanks for the post, glad to see that you checked out the property, definitely not for a residential application. However if you are interested in a 10 acre parcel right off 96 and pleasant valley rd. (brighton area) I have a client that is trying to sell a piece. This is a high growth area with nice homes in area, would make for a good small project. I have no idea what he is looking for $ wise but I do know he is motivated to sell. It has a existing house on property that has been upgraded.
He is toying with the idea of putting in road and making some splits himself, but I'am relatively sure that he would sell project and walk without going thru the effort of doing splits himself.
If your interested call me on cell 231 881 0476
I bought the rubbers before at Joe's Army Navy surplus at m59 and telegraph, been awhile since I've been down state, so I don't know if they are still there.
Danusan, I am interested. I'll ring you tomorrow at a decent time. I've started a house just south of Milford which is only five miles from the Pleasant Valley exit on I 96, so it will be a hop skip and a jump to check it out.
Thanks for the lead,
blue
talk to ya tomorrow
You ever call me concerning that property in Brighton. Dropped my phone in bathtub getting infant out and its been a little screwy, so wasn't sure if you called.
Sorry Danusan, I haven't called because I knew I couldn't make the time committment as I've been pulled in a few different directions since I've last talked. I'm halfway through that Milford job and I keep putting things off since I know I'm still in the neighborhood. Your parcel was in our conversation last week as well as several others. Your number is in my planner out in the truck and I'll dig it out tomorrow and call you. I hope your phone is dry!
blue
Blue ...
feet and backs must all be different.
if I skip my Redwing steel toe work boots and wear sneakers for the day at work ...
my lower back just kills me.
I have to wear the boots to save the back.
at the moment ... I have a pair of low-top merril hiking boots/shoes I can sneak in every now and then ... but only if there's absolutely no ladder work involved ...
works for both interior and exterior work. Even running crown on a cabinet install ... gotta be the steel shank/toe Redwings ... one foot on the ladder ... one on the cab carcass .... it not ... my feet ... then my back kill me.
Jeff Buck Construction
Artistry In Carpentry
Pittsburgh Pa
Sweaty feet? Yeah I have em. BAD. So I asked the doc what to do about it. Actually he commented about the condition of my heels. I forget the name of the condition, but it's painfull and ugly. Back to the point, he prescribed something called Drysol, which is very potent antiperspirant. Instructions say to put it on when feet will not be sweating for 6 hours, so that would be before bed. Of course my feet sweat all night in the summer!
Mark... that condition with your heels... what's the symptoms? Mine get really really thick and hard and then crack. I get real deep spider cracks that hurt like he11 and bleed. They actually get deep and wide enough to get a thumb nail in. Is this what you had? And did/does that prescription help?
I rub bag balm on 'em or this stuff my wife has called Body Butter and that softens them some and takes the sting out of the cracks.... but it still gets pretty bad.
Yeah, thick hard cracking bleeding heels. When they have been wet a while they look white and pocked with little craters. Doc said it's caused by bacteria, and gave me a fancy name that I forgot within 15 seconds. Sometimes my socks are glued to my heels so bad the leave fuzz stuck to my feet. I'm going to try the drysol starting tonite. I also found out it is only available by prescription.
I can't remember the name of it, but it's the opposite of athletes foot. There is a bacteria on the foot that eats the dry dead skin. Athletes foot happens when the bacteria becomes over active, and starts attacking live tissue. Your problem is the bacteria is not keeping up.
Stacy's mom has got it going on.
Diesel, name of the condition I have is "Pitted keratolysis"
Ladder work=uggh! That hurts me no matter what I wear. I do keep my red wings in the truck. They'll have to come out this winter.
My santa belly doesn't help my back.
blue
What a wierd question! Havent you ever used your toe to support a heavy door or a large timber? Benefits clearly out weigh the cons of steel toes.
I don't know what to tell you Trigger. Maybe I am weird... been called worse things.
But I can tell you that before we raise a wall we all bend over and lift the top plate up a couple inches with the claw of our hammers... and set it on our toes. Doesn't bother me a bit.
An LVL is about the biggest "timber" I'll throw over my foot to cut and that is usually digging into my shin so bad that I wouldn't notice if it was hurting my foot or not.
Maybe I just got a tougher toe than you? ;)
I hear ya DP. Most the framers I work with opt not to have the steel toes. I just dont understand why yet.
BTW My new boss is a Bostonian. I respect your determination towards the finish product being optimal and profitable. I also shoot for that. I have to. I like my job.
Steel YES!
Jack
Edited 11/13/2005 9:57 pm ET by TRIGGER
Steel toed boots will be colder than non-steel toed boots. Two reasons for this; steel does not let your feet breath, and steel is a bad insulator/ great conductor......it will absorb the heat from your toes much quicker than regular boots.
I try to wear my steel toed boots all the time. One thing I have noticed is that my toes will get colder, quicker, if my boots aren't completely dry when I put them on in the morning. In winter, I try and dry out the toes with a hair dryer at night.
What has worked great for me are some overboots made by NEOS (http://www.overshoe.com/industrial/products/detail.php?s=N5P). My toes can be cold, to the point of being very, very uncomfortable, put them on and in a bit Im doing much better. You basically pull them on over your work boots. They add a bit of bulk to your feet, but not much. You may be able to find them on ebay for a lot cheaper than normal retail.
I would stay away from insulated steel toed boots or safety toed boots. Never had much luck with them, they dont seem to put the insulation where you need it......in the toes!!!!!!
-m2akita
Years ago my Dad (who was a shipfitter in a navy yard) had to wear steel tipped workshoes bought thru the US Navy dept.
First thing he did when he brought them home was to cut open the leather toe and remove the sharp metal toes. Then he cemented the leather back and worked for years with shoes like that.
If you ever find an old pair, cut them open and see the razor sharp burr left when the die stamped slug of metal comes out of the die. It is then heat treated to harden and temper the steel ,only the burr is just harder now.
When I worked in an unoccupied unheated movie theater one winter, We removed all the exterior exit doors and the place was colder than a witch's teat (With a brass bra) Then we had to hang all the new metal doors that same day. Guess who wore his own steel tipped shoes? KEE RIST IT WAS COLD!
Only other time my feet got as cold, was riding in the rear of a deuce and a half with a steel decked floor through half of Germanyserving in the US Army Any oldsters remember the old shoepacs we wore? They had half inch felt insoles for insulation. I managed to get myself a larger pair and fitted them with TWO (2)sets of felt.
I was a bit taller, butI was a contented man.
Steinmetz.
Edited 12/10/2005 10:44 pm ET by Steinmetz