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Turnbuckles and rod

dg2003's picture

Happy Holidays everyone!


I have a 24' wide ranch with a 6/12 roof on one half and 4/12 roof on the other. A good portion of the structure will be full cathedral ceilings. I am looking to remove the collar ties and lighten the feel by bracing the walls and roof with turnbuckles and rods or cable. The rafters are all 2x10's @ 16". Has anyone had any experience in sizing such a system?


Thanks - D

(post #63915, reply #1 of 15)

I don't personally have the experiance, but I did install a pipeorgan in a churc in Alabama that has a web thing about it.
could not find it yet but here is the location...St Lukes Episcopal Church, (251) 666-2990, 1050 Azalea Rd, Mobile, AL 36693 They may hook you up with the engineer or Archy that designed the system.

IIRC the rods were about 1.5" diameter spanned the whaole damn room ( I actually don't like the look, but hey, it's thier church) and wee exposed..

I'll keep looking for a pic.

 


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Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations. 


 


 

www.richmondrenovationsandrestoration.com  

(post #63915, reply #11 of 15)

..St Lukes Episcopal Church, (251) 666-2990, 1050 Azalea Rd, Mobile, AL 36693

that church is about an 1/8 of a mile from my office.

(post #63915, reply #12 of 15)

cool. I was there for 3 mos. putting that thing together..was staying over on springhill ave. I think.

Ate a LOT of shrimp out on Dauphin Is.

I ferget the name of the bar we hung out in, had a funny name..like fudpuckrs or something..I almost moved to Mobile prermamnently, but the heat woulda killed me in summer.

 


Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks


Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations. 


 


 

www.richmondrenovationsandrestoration.com  

(post #63915, reply #2 of 15)

Is there a ceiling attached to the collar ties, or are they exposed?  I did something very similar, but I had an engineer design a structural ceiling ridge that was supported on each end, and then we hacked out the ceiling joists.  Really made the house look different.


 


I'm sorry, I thought you wanted it done the right way.

I'm sorry, I thought you wanted it done the right way.

(post #63915, reply #3 of 15)

here ya go...

 


Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks


Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations. 


 


 

www.richmondrenovationsandrestoration.com  

(post #63915, reply #4 of 15)

Not an answer to your question, but I once read about an alternate method.


Structure was 'cathedralized' by sistering scissor trusses to the existing rafters.  Sure you lose a little overhead, but the effect is the same.


Timber frame structures are more conducive to reinforcement with threaded rod and cables.  A stick framed structure would need to be substantially reinforced at or near the top plates to spread the load of a threaded rod pulling on it.

(post #63915, reply #5 of 15)

you mean like a barn with the stars on the walls? An a solid rod nutted across?

 


Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks


Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations. 


 


 

www.richmondrenovationsandrestoration.com  

(post #63915, reply #6 of 15)

I recently installed a pair of these on a 12 ft. wide structure. They rods were 1/2 in. on 4 ft. centers. However, there are a lot of variables, such as snow load and wind load. Structural engineers are really pretty cheap, and this is for them a pretty simple calculation.


Andy


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(post #63915, reply #7 of 15)

it really shouldn't be a problem at all... cable or rod the attachment points on the outer walls are the issue... you nead to spread that load as much as you can... which will dictate how far apart you can place your rods...  If you are wanting to put the rods/cables near your top plates...  I'd put/want to see something like a 3" x 1/4 thick angle iron... maybe hid at the soffit line on the outside then thru drilled for an  attachment/anchor point on each side...   3/4" solid mild steel rod or even think i'd look at 3/4 or 1" black pipe threaded on each end... you could tight'n from each side and not use a turnbuckle... but i think the turnbuckle would look better if thats the look u like...  if it was my house I'd think about it and do what i think would feel/look right... with never ask'n an engineer... but thats just me...  if i was concerned and what i do on my commerical projects is i draw out what i have and what i want to do and the materials i want to use... then take it to an engineer and ask "will this work" I've never yet had a no... it's alot cheaper than building to someone elses design... plus i usually have designed to fit the materials i already have or know where i can get...


pony

(post #63915, reply #9 of 15)

Or maybe the mideavel look  (how do you spell that period of time when they had castles and knights?)  ... use chains instead of solid rods.


 


I'm sorry, I thought you wanted it done the right way.

I'm sorry, I thought you wanted it done the right way.

(post #63915, reply #8 of 15)

Certainly possible.  See attached.  I have a screen porch that is 25' wide and has a 12/12 gable over it.  2x8's on the roof and 1/2" steel tie rod with turnbuckles as collar ties.  I live in NC so I only have moderate roof load concerns.  Mine are 4' on center.  The weak point as others have pointed out is the attachment point.  Mine have a 1/2" thick plate that was drilled for two 5/8" bolts.  We sandwiched the plate between two rafters (so every 4', the rafters were doubled).  The plate was notched and the 1/2" rod inserted into the notch and welded to the plate (in the shop of course).


Also, before I installed mine, I put a couple of small eye bolts on each tie so I could pull it up so it didn't sag (mine sag about 1 or 2" over 25').  And these things have some pretty serious pulling power.  I was cranking on the turnbuckle with just a small screwdriver and it didn't feel like anything, but I had deformed the roof.  I had to let it back out.  Make sure you lay out and watch string lines as you are operating the turnbuckle.


MERC.

(post #63915, reply #10 of 15)

Taunton's The New Cottage Home has a rustic house built on Nantucket with exposed exterior walls and a cable/turnbuckle system in the living room.  If you can get to a bookstore that has it, you can see a picture of it.  Sorry, no help in sizing it but the builder's name is Bruce Killen  I might be able to scan the picture after the Christmas holiday.

My oversized garage (post #63915, reply #13 of 15)

I have a large garage that is approx. 32' ft high and 17'4" wide. The previous owner cut out the rafters to create more room on a second floor that has been removed. I was wondering if rods and turnbuckles can be installed to replace the cut rafters, and if so what kind and how strong do they need to be. Any help would be appreciated.

Certainly they can be (post #63915, reply #14 of 15)

Certainly they can be installed.  One would need to know the snow load and the approximate pitch of the roof to guestimate the stress that would be placed on whatever sort of rafter ties you use.


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One question that needs to be asked. (post #63915, reply #15 of 15)

You say they cut out the rafters..............................

did you mean Joists?

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