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Siding nailer

Myrtle123's picture

I've never used a coil siding nailer.  I've got a Dewalt coil roofing nailer.  Can i run siding nails through the roofer with out harming it?

Thanks in advance,

Mike

I don't thik so. (post #198292, reply #1 of 29)

I don't thik so.

A lot of people do use (post #198292, reply #2 of 29)

A lot of people do use roofing nailers to do siding with, though. Might be worth considering unless you need some sort of speciality nail.

Depends how long you need the nails (post #198292, reply #3 of 29)

Your building a house, so you will probably need them for a long time (Groan, bad joke)

Seriously, you won't be able to use "siding nails" through a roofing gun, but you might be able to get by with a roofing nail. Length of the nail and how they are galvanized might pose a problem, though. My roofing gun will only shoot a 1.75 inch nail maximum.  Many siding companies specify that you must use a galvanized (not electrogalvanized) nail and that you must have at least 1.25 inches of penetration into the stud or they will void your warranty.  If your siding is 1/4 inch thick and you have 1/2 inch sheathing, you would only be penetrating the stud an inch. Check with your siding manufacturer to make sure you don't void the waranty on $6000 worth of siding to save $300 on a new nail gun.  I used my framing nailer on my siding (Bostitch f21pl).  the nails are full round head and I got the good galvanized nails for the siding, with ring shanks. A stick nailer (as opposed to a coil nailer) means that I was adding a new stick of nails pretty often, but it worked very well on my Canexel... And I could get nails anywhere from 2 3/8 inch all the way up to 3 1/2 inch.  I needed the length since I was going through 3/4 inch of Rmax and 1/2 inch of sheathing.

Good suggestion (post #198292, reply #4 of 29)

Thanks for the suggestion of the framing nailer. 

If you're going to use a (post #198292, reply #5 of 29)

If you're going to use a framing nailer for FC siding, be sure that it has a depth-of-drive adjustment. FC doesn't like to be crushed; nor does it like the nails to be proud.

I ended up adding the adjustment to my Bostich nailer for about 70 bucks, way less than a new nailer. It's a little heavy for siding, but works well.

The answer is "definately (post #198292, reply #6 of 29)

The answer is "definately not!" But most fiber cement products recommend using roofing nails. I got lucky and found a Duofast siding nailer at the pawn shop for $40. The older model, not the cute one. I still like the roofing nailer because you have a built in gauge for the 7" exposure that you see the most of around here.  I bought some guages to use with the Duofast, though, because you cant use a roofing nailer for trim.

What manufacture recommended (post #198292, reply #7 of 29)

What manufacture recommended roofing nail?  Check your facts.  Most recommend at least an inch of penetration into studs some more.  If using a roofing coil gun they would need to be 1 7/8 at least.  I always shoot at least 2 1/4 usually 2 3/8  hdg.  2 3/8 nail are less expensive than smaller sizes as there used alot more.  I dont like how roofing nailers have a big contact point on the gun, makes it harder to see where your placing the nail.  Look at the wrapping on the siding or go to the manufactures web site and all answers are there.

Hardie, for one (post #198292, reply #8 of 29)

Page 2 of the Nov 2010 Hardie installation guide:

 

"Blind Nailing

Nails - Wood Framing

• Siding nail (0.09" shank x 0.221" HD x 2" long)

• 11 ga roofing nail (0.121" shank x 0.371" HD x 1.25" long)"

You'd hang Hardie with a nail (post #198292, reply #9 of 29)

You'd hang Hardie with a nail that's 1.25" long?


Of all the preposterous assumptions of humanity over humanity, nothing exceeds most of the criticisms made on the habits of the poor by the well-housed, well-warmed, and well-fed.  --Herman Melville

haaaa (post #198292, reply #10 of 29)

 BLIND NAILING

recommends 1.25" nail 
 
try to get a warranty by choosing what you think is right .
 
it's the art of engineering smaller stronger better .
 
any fool can build somthing by throwing wood at it  and big nails at it . was the titanic not overkill ??mmmmmmmm
 
there that should not fall down . 
 

Let's see.  1.25" minus (post #198292, reply #11 of 29)

Let's see.  1.25" minus 0.3125" plank minus 0.5" fiberboard/foam sheathing leaves you with 0.4375 stud penetration (if you're lucky).


Of all the preposterous assumptions of humanity over humanity, nothing exceeds most of the criticisms made on the habits of the poor by the well-housed, well-warmed, and well-fed.  --Herman Melville

Hardi specs a 1.25 inch (post #198292, reply #12 of 29)

Hardi specs a 1.25 inch roofing nail for blind nailing into framing.  Not through other crap on top of framing, probably even including sheathing.  I'd use 1 3/4" roofing nails  if there is 1/2 inch sheathing on the studs.  Give it up on roofing nails if there is foam, but that's another can of worms with fibercement.

Yeah, I guess it would make (post #198292, reply #14 of 29)

Yeah, I guess it would make sense to use a nail that short if you were random nailing into something like OSB sheathing.  No sense being any longer if the nail will poke through on the inside anyway.  (I certainly hope that no one still nails siding directly to the studs in normal residential construction.)


Of all the preposterous assumptions of humanity over humanity, nothing exceeds most of the criticisms made on the habits of the poor by the well-housed, well-warmed, and well-fed.  --Herman Melville

But if you read their (post #198292, reply #15 of 29)

But if you read their instructions, they want an even longer nail if you are nailing into OSB instead of framing.  Probably to be more likely that the nail may catch a bit on a flake blown out on the backside of the sheathing.

http://www.jameshardie.com/pd (post #198292, reply #16 of 29)

OK (post #198292, reply #13 of 29)

somtimes I wonder if you really know what your talking about or just look it all up on the web???

 

some of us do this everyday and have lot's of experience with somethings .you remind me of that anoying kid with his hand up all the time pick me pick me .

 

and not have a clue .

 

now why you you bring up foam board . nobody metioned it 

 >You'd hang Hardie with a (post #198292, reply #23 of 29)

 >You'd hang Hardie with a nail that's 1.25" long?    

Yup.

 

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All of them. At least the (post #198292, reply #20 of 29)

All of them. At least the products available around here--hardie, nichi, and well, thats about it. With OSB, hitting the studs is not required. And for those groaning and thinking that you should anyways, the original siding on this house was (and still is for part of it) hardieplank 8 1/4 blind nailed randomly into 7/16 OSB. I thought tearing it off would be easy, and well, it wasn't THAT easy. The roofing nails were 1 1/4 smooth shank and they held quite well. They also didn't rust after about five years of being on the south side of the house. I am replacing the plank with nichishake, individual shakes, not the planks, so getting the nails to hit a stud on every shake is impossible. Im using a siding nail this time so I put an extra nail or two than the minimium.

>>>With OSB, hitting the (post #198292, reply #24 of 29)

>>>With OSB, hitting the studs is not required.

The last time I read Hardi's instructions, they did expect you to hit studs. I know that in the past their instructions said that either you could hit studs @ 16" OC, or you could nail through sheathing @ 12" OC, but I think that's changed. Now they want studs.

I've got to admit though, that when installing on my house I just banged 1.5" ring shank HD galv nails every 10 inches or so. Couldn't be bothered with marking studs.

from the current online Hardie instructions (post #198292, reply #25 of 29)

• HardiePlank lap siding can be installed over braced wood or steel studs spaced a maximum of 24" o.c. or directly to minimum 7/16" thick OSB  sheathing. Irregularities in framing and sheathing can mirror through the finished application.    

 

I am sorry (post #198292, reply #17 of 29)

I apoligize for that post ,it was not very nice 

Apology accepted -- I was a (post #198292, reply #18 of 29)

Apology accepted -- I was a little too brash.

I'm having trouble getting my head around frame construction with no sheathing -- does anyone here actually do that?  Even with the barrier membrane it seems like it would be drafty -- I'd think the membrane would act like a diaphragm and "pump" air into and out of the wall.  Plus eventually the membrane would wear through from the movement.


Of all the preposterous assumptions of humanity over humanity, nothing exceeds most of the criticisms made on the habits of the poor by the well-housed, well-warmed, and well-fed.  --Herman Melville

I doubt that is done on a (post #198292, reply #19 of 29)

I doubt that is done on a habitable building. Garages, walls around porches, decorative elements might be done like that.  Or once again, I could be wrong.

 

I suppose foam or dense pack insulation would keep movement of the membrane down to nothing.

Plenty of mini-McMansions (post #198292, reply #21 of 29)

Plenty of mini-McMansions around here built with nothing but some kind of wrap over the studs. I wouldn't buy one, but see them going up all the time.

I've seen that on 1950s tract (post #198292, reply #22 of 29)

I've seen that on 1950s tract houses a good bit.  But I am surprised to hear it still goes on.

Sheathing isn't a requirement of a "tight" building. (post #198292, reply #26 of 29)

Sheathing isn't required to get building air tight.  A properly installed wrap is. 

But in most areas sheathing is required to develop the required shear strength. 

When I was in Vegas, where virtually everything is gunite stucco on the exterior, the sheathing was only installed at the corners to develop shear panels, and the rest of the wall didn't have it.  But the foam and chicken wire under the stucco, and the stucco itself does a really good job of hiding waves in the final surface. 

Generally, with other siding finish options, you run into the problem, if you just put sheathing where required for the shear panels, of trying to figure out how to bring the rest of the wall out to get a surface that isn't wavy.  And, since on most walls you have covered a lot of the surface for the shear panels, it is easier to just specify the whole wall gets sheathing than any other way to get the surface regular enough to work. 

A wrap of average weight (post #198292, reply #27 of 29)

A wrap of average weight behind a wall of hardiplank or similar, with no sheathing-like material behind it, would get beat to death by the wind, at least around here.  And "pumping" in and out in the wind it would seriously diminish the effectiveness of fiberglass batts.  I suppose if you insulated with foam or cells against the wrap, that would work OK, though.

Obviously, though, the wind action wouldn't be a problem behind stucco or a similar solid siding material.


Of all the preposterous assumptions of humanity over humanity, nothing exceeds most of the criticisms made on the habits of the poor by the well-housed, well-warmed, and well-fed.  --Herman Melville

The real problem occurs when (post #198292, reply #28 of 29)

The real problem occurs when you're doing a rain-screen wall with furring strips; then, you HAVE to hit the studs (assuming the furring strips are over the studs like they're supposed to be), since you certainly can't nail between them.

 

============

". . . and only the stump, or fishy part of him remained."

since you certainly can't (post #198292, reply #29 of 29)

since you certainly can't nail between them.

I'm guessing there are about a thousand carps who've proved you wrong.  ;)


Of all the preposterous assumptions of humanity over humanity, nothing exceeds most of the criticisms made on the habits of the poor by the well-housed, well-warmed, and well-fed.  --Herman Melville